onewheeldave

Just now, sibon said:

Vaccines solve everything.

 

All we need is an 80% vaccination rate and we are all free. No masks, no tiresome hand washing. Breathe on strangers. That sort of free.

 

 

This is nonsense. You know full well that variations will require constant updated vaccines. 

11 minutes ago, The_DADDY said:

Richard Ashcroft is a man of morals. 

Hes seen something going on that he strongly disagrees with and he's made a stand. 

He should be applauded. 

Good to see him and other celebrities condemning the governments intentions to make vaccines compulsory/compelled.

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2021/jul/06/richard-ashcroft-quits-tramlines-festival-owing-to-its-covid-research

2 hours ago, Carbuncle said:

Thanks.

I didn't say it was ... but to get the diseases we get you have to avoid dying of all the other nasties and thus live long enough to suffer from them.

You said.

3 hours ago, Carbuncle said:

Ridiculous. We don't have appalling health in the West, we have the diseases associated with living long lives in a time of plenty (for us).

We DO have appalling health in the West- very high levels of type 2 diabetes, CHD  and obesity, in the main optional in that they are caused by eating rubbish food and not moving, and, they're not necessarily in those who have lived long lives, but increasingly occurring in the young. 

Not only does this affect the actual individuals, it also locks up the heath services which have to patch up the damage caused by these uneccessary diseases and manage the conditions. People go on about covid overwhelming the NHS- it is far more overwhelmed by having to deal with all the consequences of the western diet and lifestyle diseases.

22 minutes ago, Carbuncle said:

Ridiculous. We don't have appalling health in the West, we have the diseases associated with living long lives in a time of plenty (for us).

18 minutes ago, tinfoilhat said:

Part of the civilised West inclused italy how have decent healthcare system, And live - on average a full 5 years longer than Americans (although based on 2020 numbers it could be 7). They got hit hard with covid.

15 minutes ago, butlers said:

Think the US had the biggest life expectancy fall since the second world war?

Longevity ain't health. Longevity is mainly associated with keeping ill, priveliged westeners alive as long as possible with drugs.

Obesity, type 2 diabetes, CHD etc, mainly caused by affluent western lifestyle and bad diet, are at their highest levels, and far exceed the levels in poorer nations- the fact that those obese, diabetic, CHD ridden individuals are kept alive for record durations with the use of symptom management drugs, does not mean they are healthy- far from it.

If the poorer nations weren't subject to oppression, mosquitos and lack of access to clean water, they'd not only be more healthy than the average westener, but probably live longer too, despite having far less access to modern medical care.

14 minutes ago, Thirsty Relic said:

That could be it.  Remember the old addage "What don't kill you makes you stronger".  Apparently has a basis in fact.  We overcome illness thanks to our immune system being exposed to something.  Explains why healthy immune systems overcome Covid, and youngsters can overcome Covid often without knowing they've had it, and carrying that immunity onward.  I'd suggest that many Indians have overcome many illnesses and have stronger immune systems than us, especially those of us who've been staying in for ages as the pubs have been shut!  Now we are out and about, I'd suggest most of us are more at risk than before, even with vaccination.

Good point. Let's face it, one of the reasons so many people have died from covid in the 'civilised west' is the appalling health due to diet and lifestyle, with record numbers of type 2 diabetes, CHD, obesity etc- all known factors that greatly worsen ability to deal with covid.

53 minutes ago, tinfoilhat said:

 

 

Indian figures are a bit of a lottery - 4m seems closer than 400k considering 78m live in slums. And thats not including the crushing poverty and lack of medical facilities in rural India.

Perhaps in India they're more careful to count only those whose death was actually caused by covid, rather than those who died of other things but just happened to have covid as well? That would make the figures a lot lower, wouldn't it?

3 hours ago, Baron99 said:

 

 

I'm not interested in China. 

That's a shame, cos you're going to be living in it in the near future if you don't start opposing things like compulsory/coerced vaccinations.

3 hours ago, top4718 said:

Have a look into the Chinese Social Credit System to give you some idea.

It is disturbing that so many on here aren't aware of that system [or, are aware of it but think the UK is somehow immune].

10 hours ago, top4718 said:

Did anyone say it would be more or less forced on people by (initially) coercion?

They did, and were immediately labeled as 'conspiracy theorists' .

It was obvious from the start that this could all lead to compulsory or coerced vaccination, I said it myself, but, of course, was labelled as 'paranoid' and of being a conspiracy theorist. 

Actually, wasn't someone on this or the other thread demanding examples of conspiracy theories that had turned out to be true? Look no further.

7 minutes ago, tinfoilhat said:

I'm guessing the thought of night club turning you away because of what a bouncer thinks of your dress sense must twist your melon.

No. Back when I did frequent nightclubs, and it was a long time ago, I never got refused entrance due to what I was wearing. So my melon remains untwisted on that one.

3 minutes ago, Longcol said:

The point you missed is all deaths reported by tops were from causes other than covid (unless he's playing silly gotcha games) - causes that have been around for a lot longer than covid. 

I didn't miss it-  it's just irrelevant. Those people who died from causes other than covid did not feel entitled to  inflict restrictions on the rest of humanity in an effort to extend their lives.

1 hour ago, Colin Foster said:

Nightclubs are my idea of hell so this doesn't bother me at all. 

 

Just as long as they don't do the same for pubs.

That's the attitude- I don't use nightclubs therefore I'm fine with everyone who does use them being subject to compulsory injections.

I don't use nightclubs either, but I still object to nightclubbers civil liberties being damaged.

What are you planning to do if/when they make it compulsory for pubs?- cos if you were planning to object you'd maybe regret not tackling it at the start of the slippery slope.

Given that it's now compulsory for care home workers with a high liklihood of all healthcare staff next, plus now, nightclubbers, I wouldn't be feeling too smug about pubs escaping.

2 hours ago, top4718 said:

 

 

For the record I’ve seen people die of many things and have long term illnesses, I don’t think any of them wanted other people’s lives to stop though.

 

14 minutes ago, Longcol said:

How many do you know dying of a short term illness caused by a virus that wasn't known about two years ago?

Dead is dead, whether due to long term illness or short term virus, isn't it?

The point he made, which you've entirely evaded, is that the people he is referring to didn't feel entitled to  inflict restrictions on the rest of humanity in an effort to extend their lives.

1 hour ago, HeHasRisen said:

This may upset a few....

 

 

So, the start of the compulsory vaccinations that some of us were predicting from day 1 [while being accused of being 'conspiracy theorists' for it].

1 hour ago, Mister Gee said:

I guess you’re another Covid denier?

I guess you're another idiot?

No, I'm not a covid denier- I know covid exists and, as I've previously said, personally I've had zero concerns about catching it, and substantial concerns about how the over reaction to it will affect civil liberties.

1 minute ago, Mister Gee said:

To be honest I think Johnson is just showing solidarity with ordinary people, hence the U-Turn. That’s probably why he’ll be self-isolating at Chequers, a 16th century mansion house on a 1,500 acre estate.

Am I not an ordinary person? He's certainly not showing soldiarity with me by self isolating when he has zero reason to do so.

The only solidarity is with that portion [unfortunately now obviously a somewhat large portion] of 'ordinary people' who are so programmed to mindlessly follow all rules, that they do so when it is clearly insane

1 hour ago, The_DADDY said:

Fair enough. I'm happy to apologise if I'm wrong. 

So tell me, How do you decide who is a mask evading liar? 

How do YOU identify them? 

It's a simple question but if you don't want to answer it then no worries, I'll understand. 

I suspect Sibon, like many, many others, judges a person to be a 'mask evading liar' if said person by visual scan doesn't look obviously disabled, and, isn't wearing a mask.

2 hours ago, Mister Gee said:

Just got back from doing some shopping at Tesco on Infirmary Road and I was shocked to see how many people weren’t wearing masks, one bloke was having a go at a security guard for not enforcing it and he just shrugged his shoulders and said from tomorrow it won’t matter.

An early indication of just how many of the masked were doing so only because of legal compulsion?

2 hours ago, The_DADDY said:

He's lying. 

He's just following the mainstream narative. 

It's safe to ignore him.. 

13 minutes ago, Mister Gee said:

I don't think The Thick of It writers could have come up with much better than “It's Freedom Day”. The prime minister however is in self-isolation after exposure to his infected Health Secretary. 

 

Hasn't the PM been vaccinated AND already had covid? I always find it very sinister when people follow the rules when it goes against all reason and sense.

8 minutes ago, tinfoilhat said:

So the compulsory isn't that compulsory then is it.

It is compulsory in that people entering with no mask who are not mask exempt are liable to a fine [of I believe £200?].

Obviously that would require a police officer to establish that the person was faking their exemption [Transport for London officers also have the power to do this].

I've personally seen videos of people being manhandled off the tube by police/transport police for refusing to wear masks when the police believe them to not really be exempt.

6 minutes ago, melthebell said:

Real exempt people wear badges and lanyards.

Not true. Some 'real exempt' people wear badges/lanyards, some do not. There is no requirement for any exempt person to wear ID or obligation to carry proof- it is optional.

1 minute ago, *_ash_* said:

No one is forcing...

No one is forcing????? We've got compulsory masking!

1 minute ago, Longcol said:

Who for?

 

People with genuine reasons - or the people who have pretended to be disabled - or people who are happy to spread the virus to fellow members of society.

 

 

Compulsory for no-one. 

1 minute ago, sibon said:

Then they are useless .

 

It only takes one freedom ranger to parade around maskless and infected, to cause mayhem.

I disagree.

1 minute ago, sibon said:

But we aren’t talking lockdowns now. We are talking about social distancing, courteous masking, being clean. 
 

 

Masks are fine- I just don't want them compulsory.

Just now, Longcol said:

And let the big brave anti-vaxxers pretend to have a disability......................................................

I can't see much pretending going on if there is no compulsion.

14 minutes ago, tinfoilhat said:

If I may be so bold, do you have an underlying health condition?

One that I know of. But could of course also have some I'm not aware of.