Greenback Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Originally posted by Tony_BLiar Yes but how many householders have had to go through the ridicule of being questioned and charged, but then the cases are dropped, or even had to go to court but were found not guilty? Do they need that kind of treatment when they were just defending whats theres? The simple way to resolve this is to bring in a law that states if someone has broken into your home you have the right to use any force necessary. Atleast then a potential burglar may think twice as to doing the crime. That is a deterrent and thats what this country needs. Burglars who enter private property are usually hardened criminals and therefore don't care about deterrents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Originally posted by Tony_BLiar Top lad....maybe the PC brigade would like to make the burglar a cup of tea and discuss how he can reform himself, I'm sure that they would put down the VCR and talk in great depth about their deviancy and social wrongdoings! Fools the lot of 'em. whereas the hang them all (with no evidence most likely) brigade somehow feel that reasonable force means asking them nicely. You ARE ALLOWED TO USE FORCE, it just has to be reasonable. Which means not filling them full of lead whilst they are halfway through a window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
venger Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Originally posted by owdlad Sorry folks, this is not politically correct, just my opinion. When they take the decision to enter MY house uninvited they leave ALL of their human rights outside. I would be looking to remove that threat with as much violence as I deemed appropriate, that would be my decision and if that meant killing them then so be it. Thats how I feel about it, now unless they are brandishing a gun, they will have to contend with being on the end of the large wooden bat that I sleep about 4 ft away from and 2 seriously vicious.......... erm..... kittens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foo_fighter Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Originally posted by owdlad Sorry folks, this is not politically correct, just my opinion. When they take the decision to enter MY house uninvited they leave ALL of their human rights outside. I would be looking to remove that threat with as much violence as I deemed appropriate, that would be my decision and if that meant killing them then so be it. I'm with you on this one, the law needs changing to clarify the rights of the homeowner to defend themselves without fear of prosecution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony_BLiar Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Originally posted by Cyclone whereas the hang them all (with no evidence most likely) brigade somehow feel that reasonable force means asking them nicely. You ARE ALLOWED TO USE FORCE, it just has to be reasonable. Which means not filling them full of lead whilst they are halfway through a window. I dont believe that sticking up for your rights and expecting justice can signify a "hang them all" attitude. I just want people to be able safe in their homes and be comfortable to know that if some scumbag breaks into their home they can tool him, you cant ask a burglar whether or not they are going to hit the householder, rape them, stab, murder them can you? Its not like this: householder to burglar: "are you going to hurt me?"...burglar to householder: "no, I dont pose a threat to your safety"....Householder" ok, but please leave my premises forthwith"...burglar"since you ask so nicely I will do so".!!!!! We need to get real..... However I like your comment about not filling someone with lead when they are hanging outta your window...I see your point and in that circumstance I would just trap him in the window till he begs to be able to breathe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GazB Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 "What we would not want to do is extend that so you actually feel it's your responsibility to go down the stairs and actually attack the burglar," said Mr Oaten. Do they expect you to sit and wait for everything to be taken? I can see this getting to the point where a burglar breaks into your house, you go down to him and he says to you: "Sorry but you're not allowed to touch me unless I touch you first. If you have a problem with me stealing all your hard earned valuables, the correct procedure would be to call the police and wait 30 + minutes for a squad car to come out. Now, if you don't mind, I have a bag to fill up so I can go and buy some crack with my takings. All the best." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phanerothyme Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Originally posted by Tony_BLiar The simple way to resolve this is to bring in a law that states if someone has broken into your home you have the right to use any force necessary. Any force necessary to do what? Kill him or protect yourself or your property? If you are protecting yourself, family and property, you may use the amount of force necessary to do so. That is what the law currently says. Your state of mind, in being woken perhaps in the middle of the night, frightened and angry, would also be accounted for. If you want the right to kill burglars in your own home without being investigated at all, then you will be disappointed. Thankfully. Originally posted by GazB Do they expect you to sit and wait for everything to be taken? I can see this getting to the point where a burglar breaks into your house, you go down to him and he says to you: "Sorry but you're not allowed to touch me unless I touch you first. If you have a problem with me stealing all your hard earned valuables, the correct procedure would be to call the police and wait 30 + minutes for a squad car to come out. Now, if you don't mind, I have a bag to fill up so I can go and buy some crack with my takings. All the best." No one is saying that you have to sit and wait whilst they take your stuff. Where did you get this impression from? If you find a burglar in your house you are entitled to use such force as you believe is required to protect yourself your family and your property. If that means shooting them in the face with a licenced 12 bore then so be it, although it would be extreme circumstances indeed that made that the only reasonable course of action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 This debate would actually be worth having if you lot went and learnt what exactly the current law allows you to do. You can already use 'reasonable' force to defend yourself, someone else and/or your property. Taking a samurai sword and running through a burglar is probably excessive. Unless you see that he's carrying a lump hammer in which case you'd probably get away with it. Shooting a burglar or stabbing them would only be reasonable if (and this is key, stay awake) you believed that your life was in danger. If you are a big bloke and stab to death a 15 year old unarmed burglar then you might have more of a problem explaining it, but that's fair enough, you know that you didn't really need to kill them, you did it because you chose too. So, a change in the law would actually achieve nothing, all that is required is a change in peoples understanding. Based on the comments here it appears unlikely that this will occur as your sources of information seem to be on a level with The Sun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foo_fighter Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Originally posted by Cyclone This debate would actually be worth having if you lot went and learnt what exactly the current law allows you to do... ...Based on the comments here it appears unlikely that this will occur as your sources of information seem to be on a level with The Sun. My my, do you get dizzy sitting on such a very high horse ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony_BLiar Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Originally posted by Cyclone If you are a big bloke and stab to death a 15 year old unarmed burglar then you might have more of a problem explaining it, but that's fair enough, you know that you didn't really need to kill them, you did it because you chose too. Dude So if your a big bloke you cant get stabbed up by a skinny 15 year old then, just because you are bigger than them? So, a change in the law would actually achieve nothing, all that is required is a change in peoples understanding. Based on the comments here it appears unlikely that this will occur as your sources of information seem to be on a level with The Sun. Mate Dont be patronising. I am a graduate in Sociology from a top red brick uni so I know all about the laws, ethics etc surrounding this issue...yes I read the Sun but I also read all the other publications as well. Dont you think that your being snobby by assuming that Sun readers do not have a mind for themselves? You obviously havnt been touched by crime yet so when you are your attitude may change hopefully....but given your bigoted stance about us sun reading thicko's, I reckon your staff protect you from burglars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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