California bans same-sex marriage - ban overturned

[Harleyman]

Elitism maybe, judging people on their class. It was prevalent in this country, I believe that all the working class peoples of the Empire were seen as worthless regardless of their race.

 

As I said we've has an Irish prime minister in the early 19th century, the establishment accepted him because he was upper class.

 

One of several reasons for my emigrating to the New World was the class ridden society that existed in Britain back then.

 

If you opened your mouth to utter a sentence you were immediately classified as fish or fowl

 

Nobody bothered about my accent or appearance when I arrived in this country. I worked hard in the construction business, earned respect as a result and if I was sometimes called a Paddy or a Limey it was not meant with any derogatory intent

 

IF I had been fortunate enough to have spoken with a plummy public school accent I most likely might have stayed on in England and conned some wealthy upper class debutant to marry me and thereafter enjoyed the good life :hihi:

[Harleyman]

Wellington didn't regard himself as Irish and was apparently the originator of the saying that a cat born in a kipper box is not a kipper (or words to that effect - I think he mentioned horses and stables, but can't be bothered to check). He was Anglo-Irish, which meant he was an Englishman to all intents and purposes - and certainly by self-identification.

 

Not only Wellington but I believe General Montgomery also identified himself in the same way although his family were of Anglo-Irish origin

[JFKvsNixon]

Wellington didn't regard himself as Irish and was apparently the originator of the saying that a cat born in a kipper box is not a kipper (or words to that effect - I think he mentioned horses and stables, but can't be bothered to check). He was Anglo-Irish, which meant he was an Englishman to all intents and purposes - and certainly by self-identification.

 

The interchangeability of the term "British" and "English", which at the time was common practice further confuses the issue. Wellington's family though, have had their roots in Ireland traced to the Norman invasion of Ireland.

[depoix]

I never said it was perfect, but an Irishman has held the highest offices of the UK well over 150 years ago as well. Do you think that a wealthy Irish person would have trouble getting served in a place that said no Irish? I doubt it.

the wealthy irish would have lost their accent whilst at a good school,so it would be hard to tell that they were irish,unless they turned up in a donkey jacket and holding a spade in one hand and a daniel odonell c d in the other hand

[Plain Talker]

Ok, again thats a pretty good argument and I'll retract what I said about you not being a proper Muslim if you are tollerant to homosexuality! With what you've said about exercising reasoning etc, what actually made you turn from Christianity to being a Muslim? Just interested....

 

I'm glad you have retracted your previous comment. I don't drink (although I used to like a drink in moderation, now and again.) and I have no problem with people following the faith (or none) of their choice. I consider myself to be a very rational, reasoned, and reasonable person.

 

I investigated Islam, and found it attractive. It made sense of questions I had.

 

It works for me, just like Christianity, Paganism or Atheism works for others.

[depoix]

Not only Wellington but I believe General Montgomery also identified himself in the same way although his family were of Anglo-Irish origin

monty could trace his name back to normandy about the time of william the conquerer,there are many irish families that can trace their liniage back in ireland to 1167 when the normans went to ireland on the request of one of the irish chieftains, almost a thousand years of intrigation and marriage gives them the right to be proud to be called irish,many fought cromwell and queen elizebeth the first as they were defending their country and homeland,not all of them owned castles and estates

[Harleyman]

I'm glad you have retracted your previous comment. I don't drink (although I used to like a drink in moderation, now and again.) and I have no problem with people following the faith (or none) of their choice. I consider myself to be a very rational, reasoned, and reasonable person.

 

I investigated Islam, and found it attractive. It made sense of questions I had.

 

It works for me, just like Christianity, Paganism or Atheism works for others.

 

As a Muslim you may want to one day go on a journey to Mecca. This advice I'll give you is purely well intentioned

 

Some years ago I worked on a construction job in Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia practices Islam in it's strictest form. The pay was very good for the work I was doing and I brought my wife with me. While there she was not allowed to drive a car and was also required to wear head dress while in public despite her being non-Muslim. Afer a few months of this she decided to return home

 

My well intentioned advice to you is that if you do one day decide to visit Mecca be very very careful not to express the opinions you have during your visit there

[Sierra]

The Abstinence Education Program wasn't introduced until 1997, so your education wouldn't have been affected by it.

 

It doesn't seem to have been a great success, as many of those who pledged abstinence obviously subscribe to the Bill Clinton view of what constitutes sex:

 

"Researchers from Yale and Columbia Universities studied 12,000 adolescents and found that teens pledging virginity until marriage were more likely to have oral and anal sex than other teens who didn't have intercourse. Such behaviour increased the risk of sexually transmitted diseases."

 

Dozy, I read the article, and I didn't see where, when, or how this is being taught. It doesn't say. I know it wasn't at my children's schools, because I thoroughly peruse all the parent's info they send home re:sex ed. It does say this was part of the Welfare Reform Act of 1966? Can that be right? That was more than 40 years ago! It also says it wasn't funded until 2004?

 

I agree though, teaching that abstinence by itself is the only way to deal with premarital sex is a recipe for disaster, kids need information.

[leviathan13]

Good answer and at least honest. The English attitude towards the prospect of a non-white prime minister is definitely negative and basically racist

 

The funny part of all this is that so many on this forum aren't aware of this

but strangely enough are encyclopedias of knowledge when it comes to American electoral affairs

 

I'm English myself but I will say that hypocracy is very definitely an English characteristic.

 

So America may not be as racist as England politically, but when was the last time you had a female leader?

[DeanoGV]

the wealthy irish would have lost their accent whilst at a good school,so it would be hard to tell that they were irish,unless they turned up in a donkey jacket and holding a spade in one hand and a daniel odonell c d in the other hand

 

Your accent may become affected while being schooled but you would still carry the monicker of a Irish family name. Furthermore the only persons of Irish descent that you will find in UK Gov will be C.O.E. It is a well known fact that in order to climb the hierarchy tree within the establishment you must be C.O.E.