LadOnDole Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Thankfully, most people do not agree with you. I wonder how someone on the minimum wage feels when... 1) Their car insurance premiums have increased by an average of 37% in the last year 2) Petrol prices increase by almost a penny a week 3) Food prices are going up for fun 4) Gas and other essential energy resources are going up by double digit figures The list goes on...... HOw does that person get treat by such as their bank when they go into their overdraft, and even exceed it? simply because they don't have the income to keep their heads above water. So yes, these people have integrity. But when the bills are going up, their taxes are going up etc.... can they sleep easily at night? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waldo Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 well there are plenty of honest and hard working people, who pay their way and are quite frankly drowning in debt and bills (bills which are increasing way beyond what they can afford). If you cheat, you can avoid this hellish kind of exsistance. You may not have integrity, but what you do have is security. And security in this day and age, is worth a thousand times more than integrity any day of the week. Well. I don't think anyone is 100% good, or 100% bad; we're all a mix of the honest and dis-honest; as it suits us. Speaking from experience, I can say, the times when I've been dis-honest and cheated in some way; I've never felt so good about myself, and there is often some deep rooted fear at the bottom of it, that's driven me to cheat. Then on the other hand; times when I've been between a rock and hard place; and not given in to the temptation to cheat, things usually come good for me. Totally your call though dude, how you choose to live your life. Good luck to you, I say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadOnDole Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Its not about a person being good or bad, its doing what you have to do to get by. There was a time when a working man or woman was rewarded with an honest days pay for an honest days work. Ironically, it was Labour who did away with this idea while their were in office, and rewarded the workshy. The people who were the biggest victims of New Labour were the most essential people within our society, many of whom do the most essential jobs in society. If honesty pays, then yes I agree with it. Perhaps the conservatives will introduce policys that will reverse the damage done by the Labour government Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecky Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Not worth it, it's a criminal offence and besides, we always verify qualifications with the university Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwacuk Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 As a business owner, we initially fell into the trap of skimming cvs and discarded applicants below degree level. However after many years of taking on these 'educated idiots' with degrees, we have found that someone who has worked for several years far more valuable to my company than someone who has learnt from a textbook for a few years. We have since beefed up our recruitment process and now give applicants cvs the attention they deserve. I agree that having a fake degree is fraud ect ect but if you have no degree and every employer is discarding your applications then what's to lose; should these people who may have no means of getting a real degree just resign themselves to a life on the minimum wage just so they have integrity. I can say I've bent many rules to get where I am and have a successful business and anyone still a long way behind because they're worried about their integrity, I say more fool them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bojolo Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 When I started my BSc in 1999 the average science graduate salary was £16k by the time I'd finished it was £12k in 2003. After being unable to get what I considered a graduate job in the NHS (earning more than £15k) I ended up doing reception work for a year until I went back to Uni to do teaching. Which I love but was never the life plan. I think that the Labour government devalued the university degree with their idea that everyone should be able to go. Which in an equal opportunities sense is just. However, the way it transpired was that universities had quotas to fill so people who did not meet the grade criteria were accepted. Like me. This means that there are a lot of degree holders now so its not worth as much in a financial sense. I know many people who earn more than me without a degree. However, as a person what I learned by being at university, the people and the culture have made sure that I don't have the same life as my parents. I have (in my opinion) a better life than them. I've seen more, learned more and experienced more than my parents. I have more liberal views, I'm more informed about politics and other cultures. I have met a wealth of amazing people just by being in a city. I've had more opportunities as a consequence of moving to the city. I do know people who seem to have a degree that fits the job they are applying for. On one hand you could say that it serves the employer right if they don't check and you don't need a degree to do some jobs that ask for one. But at the end of the day its fraud isn't it? and I would say grounds for instant dismissal if it came to light. My degree cost me a lot of money because I had no idea how to manage money, and took on all sorts of stupid credit - my own fault. Benefit of hindsight etc. Would I do it all again? Definitely. I'd go back to uni tomorrow if I could afford it :-) Society would be much richer in itself it people were educated to a higher level. However, my main issue with society is that people consider a degree an indication of intelligence or capability, there are people out there without a degree who are more capable than people with a degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptowngirl Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 When I started my BSc in 1999 the average science graduate salary was £16k by the time I'd finished it was £12k in 2003. After being unable to get what I considered a graduate job in the NHS (earning more than £15k) I ended up doing reception work for a year until I went back to Uni to do teaching. Which I love but was never the life plan. I think that the Labour government devalued the university degree with their idea that everyone should be able to go. Which in an equal opportunities sense is just. However, the way it transpired was that universities had quotas to fill so people who did not meet the grade criteria were accepted. Like me. This means that there are a lot of degree holders now so its not worth as much in a financial sense. I know many people who earn more than me without a degree. However, as a person what I learned by being at university, the people and the culture have made sure that I don't have the same life as my parents. I have (in my opinion) a better life than them. I've seen more, learned more and experienced more than my parents. I have more liberal views, I'm more informed about politics and other cultures. I have met a wealth of amazing people just by being in a city. I've had more opportunities as a consequence of moving to the city. I do know people who seem to have a degree that fits the job they are applying for. On one hand you could say that it serves the employer right if they don't check and you don't need a degree to do some jobs that ask for one. But at the end of the day its fraud isn't it? and I would say grounds for instant dismissal if it came to light. My degree cost me a lot of money because I had no idea how to manage money, and took on all sorts of stupid credit - my own fault. Benefit of hindsight etc. Would I do it all again? Definitely. I'd go back to uni tomorrow if I could afford it :-) Society would be much richer in itself it people were educated to a higher level. However, my main issue with society is that people consider a degree an indication of intelligence or capability, there are people out there without a degree who are more capable than people with a degree. I agree with much of what you say... but... There are certainly people at university who have no place being there. But by and large they are sorted by the system. Top universities still take the most able students. The dregs go to the rubbish universities like Bolton, which fails them in their droves. Not everyone going to university comes out the other end with a degree. It is very sad that many were lured to university only to fail. They still have the debt but not the qualification. Others have a degree that is of little use to them or one from a university that employers dismiss. So when an employer is sorting job applications degrees from some universities are treated as a lower qualification. The tragedy is the money that the country invest in 3 years university tuition to those who subsequently fail could be used to lower tuition fees for folk who would actually benefit from a proper university education at a decent establishment. Horses for courses. 30% of folk going to university would be better off looking at vocational training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bojolo Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 I hadn't thought of that. People who go, pay then fail. Nothing is ever as black and white as it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anna Glypta Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 I wonder how someone on the minimum wage feels when... 1) Their car insurance premiums have increased by an average of 37% in the last year 2) Petrol prices increase by almost a penny a week They probably should be thinking if I'm on minimum wage and can't afford a car why did I go out and buy one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catpus Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 Total opposite for me. I could quite easily live with the knowledge that Im a 'dubious human being'. If I could make life easier by cheating in this way, then I would. Although it's too late now as I already have my degree, but in hindsight, if the option was there, and I knew I would get away with it, then why not. No harm in giving my family a better life. Another point, is that surely it is down to the employer to employ a suitable person for the job anyway. The degree should only supplement the applicants qualities. And if after cheating their way into the job they can't perform, they will soon be found out, if they perform, then both they and the company are winners. ***Education begins when you leave School/Uni. Virtually all you have learned before this is unused... Unless of course you are in the Medical proffession, Software, Sciences, Engineering, Humanities or Law. To be able to do the jobs I specified, you have to have studied hard, and have the ability to perform. IMO There are far too many Mickey Mouse subjects being 'studied.' Hence qualifications can be bought and abilities blagged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.