The new Islam megathread part 3

[Mr Goose]

I think the more obvious answer is looming somewhere.

 

There is intense anger in the muslim world at the west, mainly because in the countries where Islam has managed to gain or maintain power it has generally turned out "not great".

 

The arabic countries for example, are generally not examples as to how you would expect societies to be functioning in the 21st C.

 

For exampe - the question I posed some time ago, has nevered been answered. I would ask the muslim folk/supporters here to answer...

 

Why are these societies so closed to new thinking and ideas? That stat that much shame any muslim, is not the support for violence, gay bashing or jew burning, is this..

 

> More books and academic articles are transplated in to spanish from other languages each year than have been translated into arabic in the 400 years.

[kipper]

Which type of Islam are we talking about here, the one where they are blowing themsleves up or the one thats blowing us up (shytes and sunnies).

Either way, its all about controlling the masses.

[tab1]

Which type of Islam are we talking about here, the one where they are blowing themsleves up or the one thats blowing us up (shytes and sunnies).

Either way, its all about controlling the masses.

There doesn't seem to be a discussion on Islam at all but warped ignorant thinking of people like you. Power has always been about controlling the masses, and if any individual or a group uses reasoning to blame Islam as a justification for wrong doing, then it is that individual or the group at fault and not Islam that taught them to do it. If someone abuses the parliamentary system to gain power as the BNP are trying, then do you blame the BNP or the Parliamentary system?

[Phanerothyme]

That stat that much shame any muslim, is not the support for violence, gay bashing or jew burning, is this..

 

> More books and academic articles are transplated in to spanish from other languages each year than have been translated into arabic in the 400 years.

 

What's the reason for that? Why is is shameful for Muslims, rather than say Arabs?

 

(and out of interest, what's the source?)

[Mr Goose]

What's the reason for that? Why is is shameful for Muslims, rather than say Arabs?

 

(and out of interest, what's the source?)

 

I will dig out the source (it was from a moderate, western based islamic think tank/group, they regarded it as big issue)

[kipper]

There is only warped minded keyboard warrior on here that is so stuck up there own arse they dont know its summer. Such self justifying arrongance only shows your narrow minded ignorance to everything other than your own crap that you selctively dig up where it suits you.

 

You ought to get out more.

[Mr Goose]

In terms of all the debates about "I don't like the results of a survey on islamic attitudes to violence

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/2462911/Muslim-students-back-killing-in-the-name-of-Islam.html

 

I have read this report (not just the press coverage), and it is not a sensationalist BNP-esque one.

 

I think the most telling stats is that 53 per cent of muslim students, said killing in the name of religion was never justifiable but among non-Muslim students that figure was 94 per cent.

 

Remember, this suggests that 47% of muslim students and 6% of non muslim students this that killing in the name of religion is sometimes justifiable. I'm guessing that the 6% of non muslims come from the enangelical groups/socs in universities.

[Phanerothyme]

I will dig out the source (it was from a moderate, western based islamic think tank/group, they regarded it as big issue)

 

I'd be interested in the reasoning explaining the disparity. I'm assuming its an implicit criticism of the perceived anti-intellectualism of Islam, but I'd wager there are unconsidered factors that are contributing just as much.

 

Following a similar idea, how many books and articles were written in arabic and translated into indo-european languages up until 400 years ago? And vice versa?

 

What interests me is how such a scientifically and culturally rich 'islamosphere' came up with so many world changing ideas back in the day, yet appears to have reverted to atavistic, regressive fundamentalism in the present.

[Mr Goose]

What's the reason for that? Why is is shameful for Muslims, rather than say Arabs?

 

(and out of interest, what's the source?)

 

"Intellectual isolation is a widespread Arab phenomenon, not just an Iraqi one. Some of the statistics are startling. According to the United Nations' 2003 "Arab Human Development Report," five times more books are translated annually into Greek, a language spoken by just 11 million people, than into Arabic. "No more than 10,000 books were translated into Arabic over the entire past millennium," says the U.N., "equivalent to the number translated into Spanish each year." Authors and publishers must cope with the whims of 22 Arab censors. "As a result," writes a contributor to the report, "books do not move easily through their natural markets." Newspapers are a fifth as common as in the non-Arab developed world; computers, a fourth as common. "Most media institutions in Arab countries remain state-owned," the report says.

 

I think it is fair to say that the quality of education has declined, with many schools teaching mainly interpretations of the Koran, rather than other knowledge or skills.

[Mr Goose]

What interests me is how such a scientifically and culturally rich 'islamosphere' came up with so many world changing ideas back in the day, yet appears to have reverted to atavistic, regressive fundamentalism in the present.

 

I'm with you on that one - it was the Islamic academics who "saved" and reintroduced much of the great greek philos back to the west. Sadly, since the more fundementalist approach to islam has taken hold they have been in downfall for 100's of years.

 

As well pointed out by Plek on many occasions, this is partly because the islamic world never had a renaissance and thereafter never allowed their versions of Darwin et al to influence thinking and the emergence of an open secular society*

 

 

*Hmmm I wont say which SF poster thinks this was a bad thing