Don't Vote Conservative or Labour

[Longcol]

If enough independents stood there wouldn't be any of "that lot"

 

What platform would the "independents" stand on though? Do we want 600 plus MP's all with their own individual agenda?

 

Most independents are usually against something rather than pro something - seems almost like a manifesto for paralysis.

[Longcol]

For the sake ok Britain Labour musn't get in again.

 

Have you any solutions to propose?

 

Anybody can be a "not that lot" candidate - what is needed are some positive ideas.

[epiphany]

Have you any solutions to propose?

 

Anybody can be a "not that lot" candidate - what is needed are some positive ideas.

 

There are plenty of solutions. The establishment don't agree with them obviously.

 

If a government was truly progressive, its main aim would surely be to decentralise power from Whitehall and increase public stakeholdership in the economy they are a majority part of. This is a very simply concept to address and measures that could be taken have no intention of being made by Labour or Conservatives. The Liberal Democrats have certainly talked about social justice in a meaningful way, but there is a distrust of a party that has not held power for several billion years. Its competence can only be proven if empowered.

 

The "there is no alternative" crowd are voting for the inadequacy of the status quo. They have poor medium-term memory. They are unable to assess the detail of what truly affects our lives with any sense of holism.

 

The only satisfaction I'll get from a Tory government is that some 30-40% of the British population will get the government they deserve.

[Longcol]

There are plenty of solutions. The establishment don't agree with them obviously.

 

 

Interesting that you talk as if the "establishment" was a single entity.

 

From my experience it is a seething snake pit of back biting - some more principled or having stronger values than others - but most aren't working to the same end as far as I can see.

[redrobbo]

post removed by redrobbo

[epiphany]

Interesting that you talk as if the "establishment" was a single entity.

 

From my experience it is a seething snake pit of back biting - some more principled or having stronger values than others - but most aren't working to the same end as far as I can see.

 

Depends on how you see the desired ends. Ideologically there's very little difference between Labour and the Tories.

[Longcol]

Depends on how you see the desired ends. Ideologically there's very little difference between Labour and the Tories.

 

I think there is a big difference - however the art of what is possible is severely limited for Labour - anything remotely "socialist" would surely bring "loony left" headlines in much of the press.

[redrobbo]

If enough independents stood there wouldn't be any of "that lot"

 

At the 2005 general election, only 2 MPs were elected as notional Independents

These were Richard Taylor MP (who campaigned on a single issue - the closure of a hospital in his constituency). He sits as an Independent Health Concern.

Peter Law had fallen out with the Labour Party over all-women short-lists when he was elected as an Independent MP. He died in 2006.

 

However, there are currently 6 Independent MPs!

 

Andrew Spelling was elected as a Conservative MP, but was suspended

from the Tory whip when he was arrested on allegations of assaulting his wife (though there was no prosecution). He now sits as an Independent MP.

 

Clare Short was elected as a Labour MP and became a government minister. Following a dispute over the Iraq war, and other matters, she eventually resigned the Labour whip and now sits as an Independent Labour MP.

 

Derek Conway was elected as a Conservative MP, but lost the whip following the scandal over the employment of his son Henry. He now effectively sits as an Independent MP.

 

Dai Davies was elected as an Independent MP at a by-election following the death of the Independent MP Peter Law.

 

Bob Spink was elected as Conservative MP only to resign the Tory whip in 2008, later joining UKIP. Subsequently he was redesignated as an Independent MP (on the grounds that UKIP had no whip) - but has actually denied ever joining UKIP.

 

Bob Wareing was elected as a Labour MP, but following his constituency party's decision to deselect him at the next election, he resigned the Labour whip and sits as an Independent.

[redrobbo]

Depends on how you see the desired ends. Ideologically there's very little difference between Labour and the Tories.

 

This is a charge frequently levelled at Labour.

 

I could not myself remain as a Labour Party member if I honestly felt that there was no idealogical difference between Labour and the Conservatives.

 

The forthcoming general election will, I believe, sharpen the public perspectives of what those differences are.

[epiphany]

This is a charge frequently levelled at Labour.

 

I could not myself remain as a Labour Party member if I honestly felt that there was no idealogical difference between Labour and the Conservatives.

 

The forthcoming general election will, I believe, sharpen the public perspectives of what those differences are.

 

I don't disagree with that, but there will be a far greater sharpening of the public perspective if they look beyond the two-party system. Voting for the "lesser of two evils" does not solve many long term problems.