Women who wear burkhas in public in France will be fined

[boyfriday]

not surprised at all bf but i was at first having doubts about how i saw you. then along come another poster who also see s you as i do

That's absolutely fine, but why the fixation with personalities? What you've come across is another poster who shares your views and disagrees with mine which they're perfectly entitled to do.

and i thought no its just not me who sees you like this (i wonder how many more also see you like that)

Probably plenty, but so what? It isnt a popularity contest, I say what I believe is right.

this thread is about france banning the burka you have wrote numerous comments on here about this that is your choice .then you post a link up to a english migrant worker living in saudi and what she has to do to adapt to their way of life yet fail to argue why she has to do this .

I produced that link not in support of the dictatorial Saudi regime, I think your referencing of it illustrates the problem with seeing personalities rather than what people say, since your appending sentiments to my post that I dont hold.

I responded to your questions, and thought I'd clarified that issue..we both agreed the rules in Saudi were stupid didn't we?

but any migrant worker coming here to work and your on the ball sticking up for what we should do to accomadate them (the penny not dropped here yet )see i think some people also see you as a one trick pony

I think this is the thousandth time Ive said this, I'm not 'sticking up for how we should accommodate them'-it's not against the law to wear the burka in this country, I'm defending the law & freedom..just as I would if someone advocated banning body piercings or mohican haircuts, neither is for me, but it's none of my business!

 

If it were against the law and people came here and insisted on wearing it and I supported them then you might have a point.

 

Just as I believe it's wrong to tell people what they can't wear, I think it's wrong for a government to tell them what they have to wear (in terms of Saudi), which is one reason why I'd never choose to visit there.

[DragonofAna]

But the question posed by the OP was whether we should make it illegal. And straight away you are against the idea with only consideration for the immigrant or muslim or such.

 

And the reason it goes against the grain so much about muslims not having to wear school uniform is because everyone else has to conform - so why should they be exempt? Just because of their religion?

 

Something not right in your thinking when it is fine for people not to respect our ways and our rules and laws just because they are immigrants.

 

Now you can go round and round in circles some more.

 

The topic is - should we do as france has done. Answer - definitely yes.

[boyfriday]

But the question posed by the OP was whether we should make it illegal. And straight away you are against the idea with only consideration for the immigrant or muslim or such.

..now listen very carefully, I vill say dis only once The reasons I dont want it to be made illegal have nothing to do with Muslims or immigrants or 'such'-it's quite simply because the UK state does not prescribe what individuals can or cant wear.

 

As Ive said earlier I'm not particularly a fan of the static charged synthetic fabrics that football supporters wear, nor am I taken by what appears to be the rat infested hair sported by Rastafarians..and indeed let's say it loud and say it proud, I dont like the look of the burka either! I much prefer to see peoples faces, a riot of colours and a woman's legs above her ankles!

 

BUT...we all enjoy freedom to wear what we want to wear in this country, far from me considering muslims, this is about me wondering why we should interfere in what they choose to wear but exclude football supporters or Rastafarians or girls who wear short skirts-I'm merely considering personal choice and freedom and would defend that every time, even if those choices are incongruous to my own preferences.

And the reason it goes against the grain so much about muslims not having to wear school uniform is because everyone else has to conform - so why should they be exempt? Just because of their religion?

I think I gave examples earlier of other religions who enjoy those freedoms.

Something not right in your thinking when it is fine for people not to respect our ways and our rules and laws just because they are immigrants.

You're confusing me know, so are you saying it's ok for British people to wear what they want but not immigrants? I thought this was a discussion about wearing the burka which is a religious observation, not a racial one.

The topic is - should we do as france has done. Answer - definitely yes.

...respectfully, in your opinion.

[ricgem2002]

yes we do agree the stupid laws of saudi are just that .but like i said they are their laws and not ours . like our laws here people have to adapt we dont need to pander to them (and in them i mean anyone )but you are a great crusader for this when anyone says different yet fail to stick up for a british migrant worker in saudi? like i said before you and a few more have the (selective answering thread i like syndrome)

[boyfriday]

yes we do agree the stupid laws of saudi are just that .but like i said they are their laws and not ours . like our laws here people have to adapt we dont need to pander to them (and in them i mean anyone )

 

Who are we pandering to?? You are consistenly missing the point-the law of the UK does not interfere in what people wear, they are freedoms we all enjoy, Muslim women who choose to wear the burka should not be made a special case of and excluded from those freedoms.

 

but you are a great crusader for this when anyone says different yet fail to stick up for a british migrant worker in saudi? like i said before you and a few more have the (selective answering thread i like syndrome)

I think you have selective word blindness and an appalling memory, I produced the link to the English woman working in Saudi because I was sticking up for her, and have said several times since that I'm against the regime that dictates what she should or shouldn't be able to wear. (remember the stupid rules comment-I made it!) Edited January 23, 2010 by boyfriday

[hard2miss]

And you see it often on the news or in newspapers how someone has been banned from this school or that place for wearing clothing that should not be worn.

 

You talk out of some place very dark and narrow in my opinion. You stand up for the rights of immigrants and foreign visitors without reservation, and ignore the fact that most of us abide by the rules and regulations in place. For instance - my daughter cannot attend school whilst wearing certain religious jewellery, yet as soon as this happens for some immigrant there is a public outcry.

 

Most schools have uniforms that should be worn. Why should someone of a different religion be exempt? A job requires that a certain uniform is worn - why should certain religious followers be exempt? Some places ban certain types of clothing - why should amyone be exempt?

 

 

I'm just rambling now so I am going to have a cup of tea and try to calm down. Just try to see things from a different perspective once in a while rather than seeing everything people may say concerning immigrants in the offensive light that you seem to view it.

 

 

Very good post

 

Especialy the points about schools. Our school system is now supposed to be a secular one and so anyone wearing this sort of 'religious' (I use the term loosely as I dont concider it to be such a garment) should in my oppinion be in a faith school.

no garment out side of the school uniform should be allowed. You would not be allowed to wear a bandanna so why head scarfs ?

[boyfriday]

Our school system is now supposed to be a secular one

 

..er, since when?

[hard2miss]

I'm defending the law & freedom..just as I would if someone advocated banning body piercings or mohican haircuts, neither is for me, but it's none of my business!

 

If it were against the law and people came here and insisted on wearing it and I supported them then you might have a point.

 

I dont want to put you on the spot, I understand that your not here for people to have a go at over what you may or not believe in or have to justyfi what you think but can I ask your view on this point,

 

Do you think it right that given that the freedoms that you speak of do not apply in a school situation that certain things are banned in school and are seen to be outside of the school uniform, that it right that Muslim women/girls be allowed the right to wear head scarfes in school ?

Be it seen as a religious garment or a cultural one should it not be at odds with school uniform policy if we are to believe that uniforms are about making everyone the same and unified ? Does the likes of head scares not display a degree of segrigation and show a difference that should not be accepted ?

 

Schools are supposed to be about unifying and conforming but the use of these garments just displays difference to me. If they are to be allowed on religious grounds then it shows just another example where our ideals are not met by us not having the strenth or will to stand up against Islamists and say our schools are secular and you should conform, no exceptions.

[iansheff]

..now listen very carefully, I vill say dis only once The reasons I dont want it to be made illegal have nothing to do with Muslims or immigrants or 'such'-it's quite simply because the UK state does not prescribe what individuals can or cant wear.

 

I think that you are wrong there, motorcyclists are told to remove their helmets before going in banks and shops.

Edited January 23, 2010 by iansheff

[hard2miss]

..er, since when?

Since they had to give up their christian values in the name of multiculturism.

I believe now you must state if your a faith school or not other wise your concidered a secular one, or am I missing something and wrong in my presumtion ?