How can we save £60 billion?

[donkey]

Confiscate the assets of everyone who made money through bringing about the credit crunch.

[*_ash_*]

Scrap the entire welfare system which costs around 150 billion per year. (a slight, but reasonable guess)

 

I've seen posts that say crime would sky rocket. Prisoners cost around 40,000 a year to house.

 

Hence you could house 2 and quarter million people in prison to break even (providing more space was made available).

 

Gamble that 2 and a quarter million people wouldn't commit crime, and there would be a start.

[chem1st]

Welfare Benefits Source were projected to be £165 billion in 2010, although not sure what the final figure was, this is another area.

 

For this area, I would like to see:

 

- Reduction in Job Seekers allowance and benefits in general and see a good proportion replaced with food stamps (similar to USA) where perhaps 30-40% of benefits could only be spent on food. More general regulation and control over where benefits are spent would be ideal

- Those who remain on Job Seekers allowance for a period lasting 12 months or more would be required to work 1 day a week doing community work, with the amount of days spent doing community work increasing by 1 day for each year they have been on JSA. Example, Joe Bloggs has been on JSA for 3 years, therefore must work 3 days a week on community work in order to earn JSA.

- Refusal to work would cancel and void all benefits other than food stamps.

 

£165 Billion

Estimated 61.5 Million people

= £2680 per person.

 

Current JSA rates

51.85 for single under 25s - £2696.20 per year

65.45 for single over 25s - £3403.40 per year

 

I once suggested on here we could pay everyone enough to live on, my idea was ridiculed. If the rate of £51.85 was ACTUALLY enough to live on it could be paid to every member of the country for £165.8163 Billion. All the estimated 61.5 million of us!

 

Roughly a million 18-25 year olds claiming JSA, is roughly £2.7 Billion.

 

Roughly 1.5 million 25 year old+ out of work claiming JSA, is roughly £5.1 Billion.

 

But only 1.5 million claim JSA, 1 million people out of work don't claim. Making the JSA bill an estimated figure of between 4.4 and 5.1 Billion for the year. £51.85 is deemed enough to live on for a person aged 18-25, a group whom have the highest required intake of calories to maintain their basal metabolic rate, supposing you cut JSA down from £65.45 to £51.85 for the over 25s who have less of a need to eat you could save a maximum of £1.05 Billion (but only if all current JSA claimants were above 25 - which they are not).

 

The other 160 billion?

Well, there is about 29million in work. 11.5M under 16, 11.5M pensioners, leaving 7 million others; 16-18s (who could be in either work or on JSA[and already counted] or being supported by their families in/out of education), 18-25s in education, 25+s in education, the disabled (mental/physical/misdiagnosed) and those supporting themselves on savings.

 

So other options would be (I haven't the time to make calculations on possible savings)

11.5 Million pensioners * £130pw???

You could cut that down to £51.85 also, [Need more data]

x Million disability at varying rates of ??? [Hell of a lot of data needed]

Cut to £51.85.

11.5 Million children * Child benefit of ???

Cut that? [Need more data] (Maybe even raise it to 51.85).

 

Housing benefit? That is £15 Billion.

£4.5 billion of it going to private landlords - THE ONE TO TARGET! Reduce to 0, SAVE £4.5 Billion.

£10.5 billion going to council/housing associations etc. (Way too much data to track, request and look at) - Effectively it's all government employment/government coffers cash. Cut that?

 

Mortgage interest benefit?

 

Council tax benefit of ??? But that goes straight into government's coffers. Cut that? (I DOUBT THAT!)

 

Does free travel for the over 60s and disabled count as a benefit? Scrap that if it is?

 

The problem is, your source doesn't go into detail, lots of detail, or even a slight breakdown of what classifies as welfare.

 

What about NHS travel benefit, is that NHS money or welfare. Free dentists for those on benefits/low incomes, NHS or welfare? Reduced cost NHS dentists? NHS or welfare. Working tax credit? Welfare surely? Council tax benefit - is that welfare, I'd be inclined to think it is, but shouldn't be.

 

Cutting JSA isn't going to realistically going to save anything, if anything, JSA should be increased. Administering food vouchers would cost more than it could save. And forcing people to work a full day, would have them working at lower than the NMW.

 

Discincentives to work arise from high levels of taxation on the lowest earners (very much so as a proportion of income), high housing costs (which housing benefit would otherwise pay), council tax in particular (which council tax benefit would otherwise pay), Travel costs (which maybe covered by a weekly disability benefit AND/OR free transport available in the form of bought cars, taxis, buses, trams, trains), those getting higher rates of benefit (i.e. something other than JSA) etc.

 

The whole welfare system is a mess.

The combination of benefits and administration of them being major factors in the problem.

 

Anyhow the whole system has been doomed to failure for ages, because it is based upon debt.

 

If you ask me, food, housing and travel (restricted to journeys to work and work interviews, to those with genuine health need [especially if would likely be a danger on the roads themselves]) should be provided, or subsidised, but to all.

 

I struggle to see how it can be done fairly in a capitalist society.

 

You could provide people with the minimum requirements I suppose, but would they be fair, how much would you change them. Would it be sensible, feasible (essentially cost effective in the capatalist society)? Does a young man at his peak of growth requiring 3000 calories get 50% more food stamps than an old woman requiring 2000 calories a day? Does a person of 6ft get a tiny tower block flat with the roof and door frames 20% higher than the flats of their 5ft counterparts?

[chem1st]

I suppose we could always force bankers to work in job centres, if they are that good at their jobs they can make (and deserve to make millions+), think how quick they could get everyone back into work.

[Unregistered]

 

So how would you suggest we save the necessary 60 billion quid?

 

 

We vote Liberal Democrat and let financial wizard Vinny Cable work on it.

 

The trouble is, the Americans want him to work for them.

 

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[jfish1936]

A good thread started.

 

I'd like to see the implementation of something similar to the Liberals Mansion Tax only starting much earlier and that would be a one-off tax to those who have seen their property value rocket under Labour.

 

I'd also like to see taxes rise for anyone earning over £100,00.

 

I'd also like to see Motorways being charged with the money raised going to the treasury.

 

So if you make enough money to buy a historic home and maintain it, you should pay more tax? Better you live out of Britain - then you don't pay any UK tax (except on your brief visits here)

 

Remember that the people with high incomes often have the ability to arrange their affairs to minimise their tax liability; why give them more incentive? Also, please add the final zero, you obviously meant to say GBP 100, 000

 

And what a good idea to decant the motorway traffic onto secondary roads, as people avoid the motorway charges. Brisbane, QLD, has a new tunnel to "beat congestion", called the Clem 7. Its first few days saw a large volume of traffic; then the tolls were inaugurated, and it echoes emptily. The congestion is as bad as before.

[alchresearch]

I mentioned on another thread how I work in local government and we can save thousands with better computer management.

 

Don't listen to the naysayers, I'm already speaking and working with the powers that be to implement strategies that I've had in place for a while.

[brianthedog]

Tax the banks. And the bankers.

 

This old chestnut again. And increasing tax on banks and bank employees will do what?

[donkey]

This old chestnut again. And increasing tax on banks and bank employees will do what?

 

Alleviate the financial burden the rest of us are having to endure thanks to of their greedy and wreckless actions.

[brianthedog]

Alleviate the financial burden the rest of us are having to endure thanks to of their greedy and wreckless actions.

 

One way of looking at it. Alternatively, they'll just move overseas - leaving a lot of the more lowly paid staff redundant and the country worse off.