artisan Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 I totally agree artisan, but behaviour like that isn't exclusively or predominantly a black or Muslim thing, you've far more chance of being assaulted by a young, white male than anybody else. I am not saying it is by any means. It seems to cut across all the younger generation. That vast majority are great young lads, but we never get to see them. They are holed up in training centres, or whatever. We only ever see the trash that no one, including their own parents, wants. A few years ago young men were at work and learned how to behave from the older men. I cannot, thinking back, to a large intake of young men into industry within the last 30 years. The youngest man in my department is 28. What is happenning to all the young fellows these days? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Is that taking into account the difference in numbers BF? Don't worry truman, I wasn't suggesting white boys are 'badder' than black ones, but with the line of reasoning in this thread it's tempting to arrive at the conclusion that Muslim communities are responsible for the majority of crime, just because they're over represented in the statistics, but they still represent a relatively small minority of the population, so logically the majority population will commit most of the crime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truman Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Don't worry truman, I wasn't suggesting white boys are 'badder' than black ones, but with the line of reasoning in this thread it's tempting to arrive at the conclusion that Muslim communities are responsible for the majority of crime, just because they're over represented in the statistics, but they still represent a relatively small minority of the population, so logically the majority population will commit most of the crime. I'm not worried we just need to be sure we're all talking about the same thing...statistics eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 I'm not worried we just need to be sure we're all talking about the same thing...statistics eh? ..they're all 'damn lies', truman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert_Baehr Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 The killers weren't muslims. What were they then? Young black kids... Errr... are there no young black muslims in the UK then? One of the killers was called 'Hamza Lyzai'. "HAMZA Gender: Masculine Usage: Arabic Other Scripts: حمزة (Arabic) Possibly derived from Arabic hamuza meaning "strong, steadfast". This was the name of the uncle of the Prophet Muhammad who was killed in battle." Obviously, with a name like that he's not a Muslim. - He's bound to be a Baptist. ...They got 18 months for killing someone, a muslim got two years for chucking a plastic bottle, go figure. No they didn't. - One got 4½ years and the other got 3½. The AG is going to review the sentences and (with a bit of luck) they will get rather more. As for the muslim who 'got 2 years for chucking a plastic bottle', what was in the bottle? Empty plastic bottles don't fly very well, nor do they go very far. Did he throw an empty plastic bottle or was there something in the bottle? What was in the bottle? - Or, more to the point, what were people supposed to think was in the bottle? A Scottish man (who wasn't even a muslim) was jailed for 2 years only last week for making a a bomb threat. "'Tartan terrorist' jailed over Heathrow bomb threat" A threat - no bomb. - Not even a bottle (plastic or otherwise) pretending to be a bomb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artisan Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Errr... are there no young black muslims in the UK then? One of the killers was called 'Hamza Lyzai'. "HAMZA Gender: Masculine Usage: Arabic Other Scripts: حمزة (Arabic) Possibly derived from Arabic hamuza meaning "strong, steadfast". This was the name of the uncle of the Prophet Muhammad who was killed in battle." Obviously, with a name like that he's not a Muslim. - He's bound to be a Baptist. No they didn't. - One got 4½ years and the other got 3½. The AG is going to review the sentences and (with a bit of luck) they will get rather more. As for the muslim who 'got 2 years for chucking a plastic bottle', what was in the bottle? Empty plastic bottles don't fly very well, nor do they go very far. Did he throw an empty plastic bottle or was there something in the bottle? What was in the bottle? - Or, more to the point, what were people supposed to think was in the bottle? A Scottish man (who wasn't even a muslim) was jailed for 2 years only last week for making a a bomb threat. "'Tartan terrorist' jailed over Heathrow bomb threat" A threat - no bomb. - Not even a bottle (plastic or otherwise) pretending to be a bomb. Well said, and researched Rupert. Yes we must ask the question, since it has been raised, of the plastic bottle. Imagine if that bottle had been filled with petrol, and had a rag stuffed down it, lit and thrown. Would it still be a 'plastic bottle'? Or would it be better described as a 'Molotov Cocktail' without the extras Marshall Molotov had to hand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artisan Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Wouldn't him having an arabic name suggest he was an arab, rather than a muslim, the two not being the same thing? But then, my name has the name of a profession in it, and i don't do that job, so maybe names on their own aren't particularly reliable eh? Come off it man, there is only so far you can aquiesce, and you are well beyond that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spindrift Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Dr Khalil al-Ani says his son Mosab was one of the lucky ones. There was no pre-dawn raid, no handcuffs, no ransacking. He was simply asked to surrender his passport to the police. Months after throwing an empty Orangina bottle – the police said it was at them, Mosab said it was at the Israeli embassy gates – he was charged. Mosab, who was on a medical access course, hoped to be a dentist or dental technician. He is now in prison serving a one-year sentence. It was the first demonstration Mosab had been on since his family marched against the Iraq war in 2003. Al-Ani, an Iraqi who works as a GP in Wakefield and Leeds, was pleased his son would be on the march. His two sisters were also going, and Al-Ani felt Mosab, then 20, would protect them. Mosab was arrested on the day and taken to a police station where he admitted throwing the bottle, apologised, and stressed that he had not aimed it at the police. He was released and returned to Yorkshire, but didn't tell his father what had happened – he didn't want to worry him, and he assumed it was the last he would hear of it. "He didn't think it was serious because how many times have you seen something like this or more serious, and nothing happens." Al-Ani stops, and apologises for his tears. "I'm sorry I get so emotional. I came to this country in 1981. You can hear by the way I speak my accent is not purely British. It is a foreign accent after all these years. But Mosab was born here in 1988 – he is British in every sense. This is the first time I feel that because he's a Muslim he's been discriminated against. What he did was certainly wrong, but he should be treated similar to a British citizen. He's gone to prison for a single bottle that didn't hurt anybody." The astonishing thing is, he says, that the judge gave Mosab a flawless character reference. "He said, 'I know you came here peacefully, I know you have an excellent character, I know you were not armed, you said sorry to the police.'" He was sure his son would go free. "I was so pleased. Then the judge says, 'I'm going to give you this sentence to deter other people.'" http://www.islamicawakening.com/viewarticle.php?articleID=1490& Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spindrift Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Bruce Kent, a former general secretary of CND and long-time peace activist, gets to his feet to address the packed meeting. Kent, 80, had been on the demonstration and says he was "amazed and indignant" about the reaction of the police and the courts. "I don't know why there isn't absolute outrage … All this will do is solidify in people's minds the idea that there is a persecution of Muslims which is determined and organised and will result in some young people being radicalised." He says there is a huge discrepancy in the way different people are treated by the law, and recalls a time in 1986 when he had been convicted of criminal damage after cutting a wire fence during a protest at a nuclear base. "I was in the crown court waiting with my toothbrush packed. I thought I was off to one of her majesty's holiday camps. Not at all, not even a fine. Why? Because I am middle-class and white." http://www.guardian.co.uk/theguardian/2010/mar/13/gaza-protesters-sent-prison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoddyHolder Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 He threw a bottle at the police who where doing their duty,it doesnt matter that the bottle was empty or that it hit nobody,the intention was there..fair sentence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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