Why should Council workers face cuts when most are Tory/Libdem?

[Ms Macbeth]

Reading Tit99's latest inane drivel makes you doubt his sanity. He obviously hasn't altered his 'debating style' since the school playground.

 

Anyway he - and others - refers to 'Council Workers'. As most of the workers have seen their jobs farmed out to the private sector - Veolia, Kier, SIV etc. it only leaves the totally unproductive pen-pushers in their little ivory towers.

Can't see much sympathy for these parasites. Anyway, for years the public sector have been lying about 'getting lower pay than in the private sector'.

 

Well now is your chance to put it to the test. Try, for once, putting yourself in the real world and see how long you last.

 

Thats fairly offensive to social services, education, housing and other departments that are all still part of the local authority. Just because someone isn't emptying your bin doesn't mean that they are unproductive, or a parasite. I do wonder why you use the term 'pen-pusher' as a pejorative term? Ask the people who work on front-line customer services if they are in ivory towers? Most of the time they get their job satisfaction from helping people to get the services they need, but they also get insulted, spat at, threatened and generally abused by a minority of their customers.

 

Back on topic - as so many people have said, I'll reiterate - the extra expenditure by local councils has been mainly due to the government imposing more and more targets. Doesn't matter the political hue of the council, they have been driven by central government!

[Titanic99]

Well. Look at it this way. You can get through to some of the people some of the time, but never all of the people all of the time. And this is just one of those times. As I said earlier on in the thread, tunnel vision is hard to overcome.

People believe what they believe. However, I prefer to listening to factual information from those who know what they are talking about and make a reasonable judgement that way, but there are some who, even though the facts are presented to them are unable to accept them and choose to see the situation how they perceive it to be. It makes them feel better I guess.

 

I think I understand the factual information perfectly, but I will concede that I might be interpreting this differently to you.

 

To clarify my understanding of the facts are:

 

We have a Lib/Con Central Government who want to introduce cuts to Public Services

 

Most Councils are Lib/Con and have been for a while

 

Central Government are blaming the previous Government for having to do this

 

Budgets in Councils have mostly been set by Lib/Con Councellors

 

The bit in dispute is who is responsible for the opportunity to cut that the new Government believes exists.

 

Clearly I am arguing that if there is waste there then it is the fault of the existing Council, whereas you seem to be blaming Labour for waste in Lib/Con councils.

 

Which I repeat seems bizarre at best to me!

[Titanic99]

Reading Tit99's latest inane drivel makes you doubt his sanity. He obviously hasn't altered his 'debating style' since the school playground.

 

Anyway he - and others - refers to 'Council Workers'. As most of the workers have seen their jobs farmed out to the private sector - Veolia, Kier, SIV etc. it only leaves the totally unproductive pen-pushers in their little ivory towers.

 

Can't see much sympathy for these parasites. Anyway, for years the public sector have been lying about 'getting lower pay than in the private sector'.

 

Well now is your chance to put it to the test. Try, for once, putting yourself in the real world and see how long you last.

 

Thanks for your invaluable contribution to a reasonably sensible non confrontational thread!

[Titanic99]

I'll say it again - Labour spent ALL the money. None Left. Nada. Everything is gone.

 

Whether local councils were wasting money is not relevant to the above fact, except to perhaps explain where all the money went. But now its gone, budgets have to be cut to come into line with what we do have available to spend.

 

But surely it is not beong you to realise that a big chunk of the overspend you refer to went to Local Governments to spend.

 

So how can you blame Labour for Lib/Tory overspend in Councils?

[eastbank]

It seems that Local Government workers are going to take a big chunk of the cuts that the Government plan introducing.

 

Presumably the thinking is that there’s considerable wastage in these areas and that they can withstand the likely cuts in pay and numbers.

 

The problem is of course that these cuts are being blamed on the previous Government, yet from what I can recall most Councils have been under the control of either the Tories or Libdems.

 

Take Sheffield for example, this council has been run by the Libdems for a while now so why should Council workers in Sheffield be expected to have its share of cuts when the money has been spent by the Libdems.

 

So why are Council workers going to have to have cuts in their pay and numbers?

 

what the government should do is find out who voted labour in the past thirteen years and sack all them....then give all the tory/lib dem workers a pay rise....you know it makes sense

[grafikhaus74]

My bold

 

Thats fairly offensive to social services (utterly ineffective do-gooders), education (yes, we daily see the efforts of these people walking the streets), housing (see many threads about how useless these people are) and other departments that are all still part of the local authority.

 

Such as?

 

Approved Mental Health Practitioner (£34k - £38k pa)

Biodiversity Officer (£30k - £34k pa)

Community Learning Disability Team Manager (£39k - £43k pa)

Project Manager - Right to Control (£30k - £34k pa)

Service Manager (£43k - £48k pa)

Social Worker (3 posts) (£30k - £34k pa)

 

And that's just a few currently being advertised on the SCC website.

 

Financial crisis? What financial crisis?

[mossdog]

Following the budget deficit reduction plan outlined by Darling. The OBR conceded that it would have worked. Alas.....

 

That said I can suggest a positive step or you and that is to educate yourself about the deficit. You're obviously clueless about how/why it grew and happy to trot out the Daily Mail headlines.

I don't read the Daily mail sunshine,neither do I read brainwashing tripe that I suspect you read from the cut of your jib on this thread.The only thing that I am clueless about is how the last lot in charge managed to leave the building in such a dire state!lots of us saw the warning signs and why it was happening(not you!)but were powerless to do anything except bury our heads in the sand like Brown.Thankfully they've gone and we have a hope of some sense of normality returning.

[grafikhaus74]

I don't read the Daily mail sunshine,neither do I read brainwashing tripe that I suspect you read from the cut of your jib on this thread.The only thing that I am clueless about is how the last lot in charge managed to leave the building in such a dire state!lots of us saw the warning signs and why it was happening(not you!)but were powerless to do anything except bury our heads in the sand like Brown.Thankfully they've gone and we have a hope of some sense of normality returning.

 

Hear, here, Mossdog. They do present a powerful and coherent argument, don't they? Let's see. Daily Mail. Troll. All Maggie's fault. Right-wing Nazi, er that's about it. But if anyone saw Dispatches on Ch4 last night, it's obvious the bankers have changed none of their behaviour and the next financial crisis is all but inevitable.

[mj.scuba]

We have a Lib/Con Central Government who want to introduce cuts to Public Services

INCORRECT

We have a Lib/Con Central Government who want have to introduce cuts to Public Services

 

Most Councils are Lib/Con and have been for a while

CORRECT

 

Central Government are blaming the previous Government for having to do this

Bang on right, waste doesn't just exist at local level but at central government too. Just look at the scorched earth policy Labour took on when their imminent demise was upon them....spend, spend, spend....senior treasury staff were so concerned that they sought written confirmation so they wouldn't get the blame. Does that sould like a financially responsible central government to you? (probably )

 

Budgets in Councils have mostly been set by Lib/Con Councellors

CORRECT

 

The bit in dispute is who is responsible for the opportunity to cut that the new Government believes exists.

Local councils will be responsible for managing their budgets and living within their means just as they were before, and for cutting services to fit the new budgets. Central government departments will still be responsible for managing their budgets and living within their means, and for cutting services to fit the new budgets.

 

Clearly I am arguing that if there is waste there then it is the fault of the existing Council, whereas you seem to be blaming Labour for waste in Lib/Con councils.

 

Which I repeat seems bizarre at best to me!

 

Labour are responsible for central government waste 1997-2010. Lets not forget they were running the economy in defecit even in the boom years whilst many other countries were living within their means, even running with a surplus.

 

Local councils are responsble for waste at the local level, whatever the controlling party.

 

However Cameron & Osbourne were holding up Tory councils as models of budgetary responsibility that central government could learn much from. I wonder why they would do that if they thought their own councils were just as bad as Labour ones?

 

It is in the Labour mindset to tax and spend, it is the Tory mindset to keep taxes low and spending in check, so in terms of waste from local councils, I would wager that local waste is disproportionately represented by the Labour councils.

[RonJeremy]

INCORRECT

We have a Lib/Con Central Government who want have to introduce cuts to Public Services

 

CORRECT

 

Bang on right, waste doesn't just exist at local level but at central government too. Just look at the scorched earth policy Labour took on when their imminent demise was upon them....spend, spend, spend....senior treasury staff were so concerned that they sought written confirmation so they wouldn't get the blame. Does that sould like a financially responsible central government to you? (probably )

 

 

CORRECT

 

 

Local councils will be responsible for managing their budgets and living within their means just as they were before, and for cutting services to fit the new budgets. Central government departments will still be responsible for managing their budgets and living within their means, and for cutting services to fit the new budgets.

 

 

 

Labour are responsible for central government waste 1997-2010. Lets not forget they were running the economy in defecit even in the boom years whilst many other countries were living within their means, even running with a surplus.

 

Local councils are responsble for waste at the local level, whatever the controlling party.

 

However Cameron & Osbourne were holding up Tory councils as models of budgetary responsibility that central government could learn much from. I wonder why they would do that if they thought their own councils were just as bad as Labour ones?

 

It is in the Labour mindset to tax and spend, it is the Tory mindset to keep taxes low and spending in check, so in terms of waste from local councils, I would wager that local waste is disproportionately represented by the Labour councils.

 

an excellent logical post