Apology: "Homeopathy is not witchcraft, it is nonsense on stilts"

[discodown]

When there isn't enough money for stuff that does work can you justify spending NHS money on stuff that doesn't?

The placebo effect is very strong so arguably people think it works and that can be enough to make it work. Therapy works for some people but not others and thats on the NHS should we ban everything that doesn't have a 100% success rate?

[discodown]

Im divided in my thoughts on Homeopathy. Is it all in the mind ? Even if it is, the mind is a powerful tool within the healing process dont you think ?

I do think that, which is why i'm not down on it. If people believe themselves better because of it then its hard to knock it

[onewheeldave]

Yes it can do harm. Somebody taking homeopathic medicine instead of the proper treatment will often end up requiring more expensive treatment later on, with the homeopathy just taking up time which could have been far better spent with other early treatments, the earlier you tackle something the more likely to cure it quickly you are, and so far more cheaply.

 

Homeopathy instead of proven treament can waste time, money and lives.

 

here's what i said-

 

Originally Posted by onewheeldave:

 

Whereas, with homeopathy, even the most stringent opponent, however much they believe that the remedies are, on their terms, ineffective (other than placebo effect), must, by defintion, also believe that, chemically speaking, a homeopathic remedy can do no harm (as, chemically speaking, there is no active drug it it) (other than any harm which may be judged to have indirectly occurred due to the patient refusing to use conventional treatments).

 

I did mention the indirect harm you're referring to.

 

That harm of course, is not caused by the homeopathic remedy, but, by the persons decision to not have conventional treatment.

 

i.e. it's caused by their choice.

 

they could (and many do) have had both the homeopathic remedy and conventional treatment.

 

Equally, they could have not had the homeopathic remedy and still refused conventional treatment.

 

For example, some people with some kinds of cancer refuse conventional treatment because they consider it too invasive, or whatever- that's their choice- if they are of sound mind it is soley their choice.

[Bloomdido]

There is a whole flipping hospital in London.

 

Should be number one on the cuts list; no doubt.

 

An ex of mine went to Whitechapel Hospital many years ago to see a homeopathic doctor. Perhaps because she had irritable bowel syndrome and no-one knew how to treat it at the time or even if it was a real illness. I went with her. The 'doctor' told her not to use aluminium pans for cooking food in. Wasn't there some link with that and alzheimer's later or did I imagine it.

 

Like Tim Minchin says, they have a word for alternative medicine that has been proved to work. It is called medicine.

[pattricia]

I do think that, which is why i'm not down on it. If people believe themselves better because of it then its hard to knock it

 

People were given a placebo in trials and told it was a powerful drug which would make them feel much better. They actually did feel better.

[Tony]

But they weren't actually better.

 

If people believe themselves better because of it then its hard to knock it

Except that they aren't getting better and it doesn't work. Nobody has ever wished themselves better, ever.

 

Some people die if they believe that homoeopathy works. Should the NHS pay for something that kills people instead of curing them?

[Berberis]

Woot!

 

Common sense - 1

[discodown]

Some people die if they believe that homoeopathy works. Should the NHS pay for something that kills people instead of curing them?

There are a lot of things the NHS pays for that have the potential to kill people. Should we stop the NHS paying for it?

[milquetoast1]

Im divided in my thoughts on Homeopathy. Is it all in the mind ? Even if it is, the mind is a powerful tool within the healing process dont you think ?

 

Here is Ben Goldacre talking about the placebo effect on the NHS site. It is certainly a real but poorly understood effect, but it doesn't mean to say that we should be financing it.

 

Much of the "benefit" of a homeopathy consultation may be that the average time spent with the patient is 45 mins or so rather than the 8 mins average you will get with your GP. Sometimes a nice chat with somebody is all that's needed. But even if this is true then those resources spent on homeopathy consultations would be better spent getting the average GP consultation times up for everybody.

[Tony]

There are a lot of things the NHS pays for that have the potential to kill people. Should we stop the NHS paying for it?

 

Yes but those things can also make people better, unlike homoeopathy.