Does this happen to girls in england?

[nerd]

I've never heard of this before, it's awful. Poor girls.

In one of the links it says FGM is sometimes reffered to as Female Circumcision, i was wondering if anybody knows why male circumcision is legal but this isn't. I'm NOT saying that it should be made legal, just wondering why one is and one isn't??

 

I'm not sure really why male circumcision is also allowed but referring to FGM as a "circumcision" really detracts from the true horror of the procedure. I think that in females and equivilent to male circumcision would be the removal of the clitoral hood, as male circumcision is the removal of the foreskin. Not really sure why they do this to males so routinely - I always thought it was kind of like saying god made a mistake when he put that skin there! anyways..

 

FGM can be on a scale of severity - from the removal of the clitoris, the removal of the clitoris and labia, or the removal of the clitoris and labia, the inside of the vagina is then scored and the outer skin sewn together, leaving a pin prick hole through which urine and menstrual fluid are meant to flow. this third version is called inifbulation. Of the different types of FGM this is the worst, although all 3 have massive complications,can lead to death and remove the ablity for female sexual pleasure.

I think that the equivilent of FGM if it was on a male would be the removal of the whole penis.

[cuttsy]

Even nowedays in hospital (for medical reasons) Dr's are reluctant to remove the foreskin on children. A couple of my friends boys have had problems down there with urinating etc and Dr's have said although removing the foreskin would help, in the long run it actually doesnt and they prefer to let them grow before drastic action so it is slowly becoming less practiced!! In both cases the Dr was right and alls fine now with all intact!

[mafya]

I am not so sure about your first statement. At best, Islam condones it, at worst it sanctions it. There is a film a friend linked to and I have put on my website. It graphically illustrates the violence meted out to women in some Islamic countries. I found it truly shocking and had to force myself to watch it. This is a family forum so I'm not putting on a link.

 

I also think it abhorrent that male circuncision is not seen as child abuse.

 

Islam doesn't condone or sanction female circumcision, this is just a cultural/tribal thing carried out mostly on the African continent by some tribal people who happen to be muslim.

This is a barbaric practice and any muslims carrying this out are not true muslims.

[icon76]

Islam doesn't condone or sanction female circumcision, this is just a cultural/tribal thing carried out mostly on the African continent by some tribal people who happen to be muslim.

This is a barbaric practice and any muslims carrying this out are not muslims.

 

The bold bit doesn't make much sense.

 

I assume you mean anyone who subscribes to the muslim faith and does this is not being a good muslim as defined by the muslamic laws etc?

[Plain Talker]

I'm not sure really why male circumcision is also allowed but referring to FGM as a "circumcision" really detracts from the true horror of the procedure. I think that in females and equivilent to male circumcision would be the removal of the clitoral hood, as male circumcision is the removal of the foreskin. Not really sure why they do this to males so routinely - I always thought it was kind of like saying god made a mistake when he put that skin there! anyways..

 

FGM can be on a scale of severity - from the removal of the clitoris, the removal of the clitoris and labia, or the removal of the clitoris and labia, the inside of the vagina is then scored and the outer skin sewn together, leaving a pin prick hole through which urine and menstrual fluid are meant to flow. this third version is called inifbulation. Of the different types of FGM this is the worst, although all 3 have massive complications,can lead to death and remove the ablity for female sexual pleasure.

I think that the equivilent of FGM if it was on a male would be the removal of the whole penis.

 

Actually, the severity of this abhorrent practice ranges from the removal of the clitoral hood (akin to what is done to the male foreskin) through to the extreme removal of much of the labia and external genitals.

 

Regardless, it is no bad thing, at all, that this country has now made it law that it is even illegal for the child to be removed from this country in order to have this done to them, not just that it is illegal for this to be done to the child.

 

This practice causes horrendous problems for the woman who has endured this, as it makes it almost impossible for her to give birth normally. (As has been mentioned above, it also causes difficulties in simply having sex, and in taking pleasure in it.)

 

 

Nowhere in any holy scriptures, of any religion, does it say that this is a commandment that it be done unto a girl-child.

[Plain Talker]

The bold bit doesn't make much sense.

 

I assume you mean anyone who subscribes to the muslim faith and does this is not being a good muslim as defined by the muslamic laws etc?

 

Mafya means, quite clearly, that the person inflicting this on a child, be it a by-standing but complicit parent, or the person actually mutilating the child is not acting in accordance with any credo or commandment within the Muslim religion.

 

Indeed, they are acting against the edicts in the Qur'an which say that a man must ensure that the wife is given pleasure when they make love, when the mutilators commit the mutilation on the girl-child and prevent her from having pleasure.

[icon76]

Mafya means, quite clearly, that the person inflicting this on a child, be it a by-standing but complicit parent, or the person actually mutilating the child is not acting in accordance with any credo or commandment within the Muslim religion.

 

Indeed, they are acting against the edicts in the Qur'an which say that a man must ensure that the wife is given pleasure when they make love, when the mutilators commit the mutilation on the girl-child and prevent her from having pleasure.

 

I fully agree with the sentiments, just the "quite clearly" bit is off tangent. If you say any muslim who does xyz is not a muslim it's like saying any horse that rears up is not a horse. Plainly if they are a muslim then they are a muslim, they might not be a "good muslim" but if by the posters definition they are a muslim then a muslim they must be.

 

Also blaming "dem natives" when the alledgedly super islamic system has ruled over them for a thousand years is a tad weak.

[Plain Talker]

Alastair, I can't see the point in making love with someone who can't respond with pleasure, either.

 

Surely the whole point of making love with your partner is the reciprocal pleasure:- you knowing that you've given them pleasure, and them knowing that they have given pleasure to you.

[Plain Talker]

I fully agree with the sentiments, just the "quite clearly" bit is off tangent. If you say any muslim who does xyz is not a muslim it's like saying any horse that rears up is not a horse. Plainly if they are a muslim then they are a muslim, they might not be a "good muslim" but if by the posters definition they are a muslim then a muslim they must be.

 

Also blaming "dem natives" when the alledgedly super islamic system has ruled over them for a thousand years is a tad weak.

 

I stand by my comments that it's un-Islamic.

[nerd]

...

 

It's rooted in the most primitive genetic fears in that a woman knows who her children are, but a man can never be 100% certain. Hence the need to control women and take away any sexual pleasure so they don't have another man's children.

 

But where's the fun in shagging a woman who has had surgery so she can't enjoy it??

...

 

I think also that it is commonly practiced in places where there is a bizarre sense of "honour" attached to the virginity of the girls, and a girl who has been horrifically mutilated and sewn up so that there is only a tiny hole for urination, then everybody can be fairly sure that she is a virgin.

It is a barbaric way of trying to control women, using such excuses as "honour". Yet there is no reason or excuse for this kind of torture.

theres also some bizarre idea that if a woman cannot derive pleasure from sex she will not have sex with anyone else.