Toby Foster and Harrow Halal meat

[boyfriday]

My stance is about discrimination against English children, special treatment for Muslims, and English children being dictated to.

 

How do you arrive at that conclusion? Surely the English children being discriminated against are the Muslim ones, who would be denied the opportunity to eat meat if halal meat wasn't included on school menus? Conversely, there's no restriction on non Muslims whether they choose to eat it or not, if there were you might have a point.

[Grahame]

How do you arrive at that conclusion? Surely the English children being discriminated against are the Muslim ones, who would be denied the opportunity to eat meat if halal meat wasn't included on school menus? Conversely, there's no restriction on non Muslims whether they choose to eat it or not, if there were you might have a point.

 

The English children have no choice, how is that not discrimination? It is more than discrimination, it is dictatorial.

[boyfriday]

What are you talking about! We eat halal meat. There is no "shame" of the English. And don't you go implying there is.

 

Read my post. We also eat vegetables, but don't dictate to vegetarians that they should eat meat, just because we do.

 

So by calling me a 'strawman', the shame is mutual, since I was using your own argument to challenge what you said.

[Grahame]

Read my post. We also eat vegetables, but don't dictate to vegetarians that they should eat meat, just because we do.

 

So by calling me a 'strawman', the shame is mutual, since I was using your own argument to challenge what you said.

 

The subject is meat and vegetarians have the choice, the English schoolchildren don't have that choice, unless they go without.

 

Introducing vegetables is a strawman.

[boyfriday]

The English children have no choice, how is that not discrimination? It is more than discrimination, it is dictatorial.

I'm not sure what the problem is, you've already said 'we' already eat halal meat, you said you're 'happy' to eat it.

 

If that's the case the halal issue isn't relevant to the vast majority of people. If it were then schools should be offering universal options to cater for every eventuality-organic, vegan, gluten intolerant, lactose intolerant, fruitarian, non halal meat eaters etc etc etc.

 

The Daily Star article that Toby Foster highlighted, says only this about the halal meat that is being supplied to schools-they didn't confirm that the meat supplied isn't pre-stunned:

 

Mums and dads in other areas said schools are already making children eat dishes that contain meat from animals which are killed by having their throats slit and bleeding to death.

 

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/148006/Halal-school-meals-or-go-hungry/

 

Perhaps someone should have told them that this happens in conventional slaughter too, it's rather benignly referred to as 'sticking', so if these parents are outraged about livestock having its throat slit and bled to death then they better denounce meat eating and become vegetarians.

[boyfriday]

The subject is meat and vegetarians have the choice, the English schoolchildren don't have that choice, unless they go without.

 

Introducing vegetables is a strawman.

 

Introducing halal meat in schools is the strawman, since the meat supplied to schools has been pre-stunned, then had it's throat slit and is bled to death....just like normal meat.

 

The only difference is that the slaughter is overseen by someone in the Muslim faith who rants some mumbo jumbo over the carcass.

 

Ps-the majority of Muslim children in schools will be English.

[Grahame]

I'm not sure what the problem is, you've already said 'we' already eat halal meat, you said you're 'happy' to eat it.

 

If that's the case the halal issue isn't relevant to the vast majority of people. If it were then schools should be offering universal options to cater for every eventuality-organic, vegan, gluten intolerant, lactose intolerant, fruitarian, non halal meat eaters etc etc etc.

 

The Daily Star article that Toby Foster highlighted, says only this about the halal meat that is being supplied to schools-they didn't confirm that the meat supplied isn't pre-stunned:

 

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/148006/Halal-school-meals-or-go-hungry/

 

Perhaps someone should have told them that this happens in conventional slaughter too, it's rather benignly referred to as 'sticking', so if these parents are outraged about livestock having its throat slit and bled to death then they better denounce meat eating and become vegetarians.

 

If you don't know what the problem is then you do not understand about freedom of choice or the fact that English children are being told to "Take it or leave it."

 

Try telling that to a Muslim, or PT.

[boyfriday]

If you don't know what the problem is then you do not understand about freedom of choice or the fact that English children are being told to "Take it or leave it."

 

Try telling that to a Muslim, or PT.

 

..but we've already established that the majority of non Muslims already eat halal meat haven't we? Whereas we know that Muslim only eat halal meat. So what's the point in denying Muslim children meat in school, when their classmates are already halal meat eaters?

 

If non Muslims didn't eat halal meat, then your point would be entirely legitimate.

[Player 1]

Problem solved, whats everyone moaning about?

 

..you're quite right, the reason for making the point is that most non Muslim children have quite innocently and enthusiastically troughed down halal meat when they eat restaurant curries, doner kebabs and burgers from non franchised takeaways.

 

Conversely the same isn't true for Muslim or Jewish children who are pretty much constrained by what they can eat .

 

So no one minds that a foreign culture(in this case an Islamic law) regarding food, is in force in British schools? thats the real issue here, a foreign law-because thats what Halal actualy means - lawfull or legal, or permissible in Islam.

[Grahame]

Introducing halal meat in schools is the strawman, since the meat supplied to schools has been pre-stunned, then had it's throat slit and is bled to death....just like normal meat.

 

The only difference is that the slaughter is overseen by someone in the Muslim faith who rants some mumbo jumbo over the carcass.

 

Ps-the majority of Muslim children in schools will be English.

 

Basically I do not believe you. Read again my first post of today.

 

http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showpost.php?p=6559742&postcount=119

 

Also Muslim children may be English by nationality (a piece of paper) but they still retain the customs of their country in faith and deed as we can see in every aspect of their lives. Their dress, food and religion which is far from being English.