Angry at schools dictatorship/need advice.

[Mr Prime]

Does this society of "Britain and it's sub section of south Yorkshire" have a website I can find out more about, it's a new one to me.

Most societies have a dedicated website to tell you what it's all about.

 

This is not a philosophy class. I don't know what kind of profound point you are trying to make.

[Digsy]

Shortly after me then but you sound like you were in a different country. Why seek privacy? Did it matter if anyone saw you? In my non 'progressive' school if you were given detention you did it, no bills or money involved. However I guess none of the 'silly' parents at my school challenged their kids being disciplined. Parents and teachers should be united under the simple idea of rules are obeyed or punishment follows. We were told that when we were adults we could challenge authority. I don't see the benefit of kids learning that everything is up for questioning. But I don't believe that schools are evil factories or that the MMR jab is state control or Jamie Oliver is stupid to suggest eating food at school instead of excreta.

 

Yes it did and still does matter people seeing me naked, apart from my wife, very few will ever get to see me naked and even then it would be by chance.

My parents are both deaf, they can barely understand what a teacher says never mind challenge my discipline, a teacher cannot discipline me any more than I can discipline myself, and detention is not my chosen method of self discipline.

If the rules breach your rights, you are willing to accept that?

That's your choice, I am not so gullible.

 

I don't believe that schools are evil factories either, in fact school is the most useful thing there is for any child, it's up to the child how they will use it, A school/teacher/tutor can only teach you so much and you can be assured that your rights are not a priority.

 

You would also be amazed at how teachers are willing to treat you as an equal once they see you as one.

[Digsy]

This is not a philosophy class. I don't know what kind of profound point you are trying to make.

 

It's quite simple, if your society wants to punish children for crimes they haven't committed or played any part in, I want no part of it.

Thankfully it's not a society I've heard of never mind been a part of.

[hard2miss]

I don't resent kids but I have seen the ugly differences between how my friends and I were and how a lot of kids today are. Arguing with parents and teachers, calling then names in anger as they get out of their dads taxi. Kids wailing about being forced to eat food they don't like as if they can have ice cream 3 times a day.

 

People can bring up their kids how they see fit but what if they are useless parents who produce spoilt brats because they keep telling them that they are 'special' or go mad over every perceived slight at school?

 

Well I have several teacher friends and have not heard about this corporatisation but I am open to persuasion. They just say they have problems with kids falling asleep in class then the parent saying "well he needs his sleep" or kids with eczma conditions on their hands and the parents shrugging their shoulders or other kids thinking they are 'best' because mummykins told told her she is a princess. It's quite disturbing.

Your talking about society in general. Kids are bad today even from when I was a kid, no doubt tomorrows kids will be worse.

 

maybe it has something to do with us becoming more secular and the morals of religion not being taught in school, who knows. Today's religious education skips right over the moral aspect and just goes on about acceptance and understanding, and is more about promoting multiculturalism than what it was when I was a kid.

 

We are lost socially but its not the kids fault being born into the age they are.

[Mr Prime]

It's quite simple, if your society wants to punish children for crimes they haven't committed or played any part in, I want no part of it.

Thankfully it's not a society I've heard of never mind been a part of.

 

Well you have lived in it all your life unless your school was some kind of democracy. Maybe it was one of those experimental progressive schools. 'My society' as you call it is just my experience at school. I naively thought most schools were and still are like it.

[Mr Prime]

Yes it did and still does matter people seeing me naked, apart from my wife, very few will ever get to see me naked and even then it would be by chance.

My parents are both deaf, they can barely understand what a teacher says never mind challenge my discipline, a teacher cannot discipline me any more than I can discipline myself, and detention is not my chosen method of self discipline.

If the rules breach your rights, you are willing to accept that?

That's your choice, I am not so gullible.

 

I don't believe that schools are evil factories either, in fact school is the most useful thing there is for any child, it's up to the child how they will use it, A school/teacher/tutor can only teach you so much and you can be assured that your rights are not a priority.

 

You would also be amazed at how teachers are willing to treat you as an equal once they see you as one.

 

Well surely you know what you look like naked and nobody else cared/s?

 

When I was a kid at school and had broken the rules in a serious matter I accepted my punishment, I did not go running to anyone wailing my rights. We were given warnings and if we stepped over...I must have been gullible. I don't see what's wrong with that. The result of people thinking about their individual rights is seen when people park their cars anywhere and are upset when they get ticketed or are mortified when a speed camera catches them as if the speed limits are an opinion. These days I am a union rep amongst other things and my managers would never class me as supine or gullible but a kid doesn't have rights apart from the basics concerning harm. School punishments are not harmful and have not been since the 50's or whenever.

[Digsy]

Well you have lived in it all your life unless your school was some kind of democracy. Maybe it was one of those experimental progressive schools. 'My society' as you call it is just my experience at school. I naively thought most schools were and still are like it.

 

No I think you'll find that this society you claim to be a part of is fictional, does not exist.

 

Even if you did mean the British Society built up of the English Society, Society of Northern Ireland, Scottish Society, Welsh Society, which in turn contain thousands of smaller societies, like the Islamic Society of Britain, British Computer Society and Clown society.

 

Funnily enough all these Societies still adhere to the Universal Charter of Human Rights.

[Mr Prime]

Your talking about society in general. Kids are bad today even from when I was a kid, no doubt tomorrows kids will be worse.

 

maybe it has something to do with us becoming more secular and the morals of religion not being taught in school, who knows. Today's religious education skips right over the moral aspect and just goes on about acceptance and understanding, and is more about promoting multiculturalism than what it was when I was a kid.

 

We are lost socially but its not the kids fault being born into the age they are.

 

I can't disagree with any of that. I am a securalist but believe morals should be taught since I follow christian morals without believing in God. I would say multicultaralism has to be taught to increase understanding. My problem is that kids seem to know what the law can and can't do and how far they can push it but have no concept of responsibility with their rights. The way they talk to their parents is amazing and is on an equal parents as friends level. That is wrong. Having said all that maybe I've turned into an old fart and I know that the majority of under 18's are basically fine.

[Digsy]

Well surely you know what you look like naked and nobody else cared/s?

 

When I was a kid at school and had broken the rules in a serious matter I accepted my punishment, I did not go running to anyone wailing my rights. We were given warnings and if we stepped over...I must have been gullible. I don't see what's wrong with that. The result of people thinking about their individual rights is seen when people park their cars anywhere and are upset when they get ticketed or are mortified when a speed camera catches them as if the speed limits are an opinion. These days I am a union rep amongst other things and my managers would never class me as supine or gullible but a kid doesn't have rights apart from the basics concerning harm. School punishments are not harmful and have not been since the 50's or whenever.

 

When I was a child in school I made sure I didn't break the rules, but first I had to learn the rules, and if I did happen to break them, I would make sure it didn't happen a second time, such is the lessons of life.

I didn't need to go running off to anyone wailing anything, a one to one conversation with the person issuing the order was sufficient.

And the order is soon dropped when faced with the possibility of receiving a bill.

 

Who says you learn lessons from being punished, I guess you are also under the belief that the prison system works and nobody re-offends.

 

The child in this thread is being punished for something it has no control over.

You seem to think that's ok.

[Mr Prime]

No I think you'll find that this society you claim to be a part of is fictional, does not exist.

 

Even if you did mean the British Society built up of the English Society, Society of Northern Ireland, Scottish Society, Welsh Society, which in turn contain thousands of smaller societies, like the Islamic Society of Britain, British Computer Society and Clown society.

 

Funnily enough all these Societies still adhere to the Universal Charter of Human Rights.

 

Well fine. The 800 pupils at my skool obviously lived in a parallel universe. I am yet to hear of the human rights act being used in schools to block detentions and other punishments. I would be interested to see what schools are allowed to do in your view. My teacher friends schools seem to have the same rules as the ones we went to 20 years ago, detentions, suspensions, removals from class and teachers shouting at misbehaving pupils. I expect that is oppressive in your eyes?