Government run euthanasia centres?

[msmouse]

As the Government is keen to completely dismantle the welfare state, destroy the NHS via the back door and devalue the pound using more QE (with the inevitable effect of hyper-inflation) life is literally going to become unsustainable for the poorest most vulnerable people in society. With the current closure of care homes, massive reduction of provision for social care in the community and the targetting of the disabled to 'get a job' when there is no realistic prospect that they would be taken on by anybody even if there were jobs out there (never mind what other horrors await with the coming cuts) people are going to be driven to such levels of despair that they would rather be dead.

 

Given that all people on welfare are being viciously been attacked from all quarters as 'parasites' why does the Government not set up a programme where they can be get rid of once and for all? I'm sure the ConDems would be ecstatic to see them go (and probably offer incentives to the likes of Atos for each person they help to be 'put down').

 

Just a thought.

[Tony]

Will the people who haven't been paying attention be first?

[matsalleh]

As the Government is keen to completely dismantle the welfare state, destroy the NHS via the back door and devalue the pound using more QE (with the inevitable effect of hyper-inflation) life is literally going to become unsustainable for the poorest most vulnerable people in society. With the current closure of care homes, massive reduction of provision for social care in the community and the targetting of the disabled to 'get a job' when there is no realistic prospect that they would be taken on by anybody even if there were jobs out there (never mind what other horrors await with the coming cuts) people are going to be driven to such levels of despair that they would rather be dead.

 

Given that all people on welfare are being viciously been attacked from all quarters as 'parasites' why does the Government not set up a programme where they can be get rid of once and for all? I'm sure the ConDems would be ecstatic to see them go (and probably offer incentives to the likes of Atos for each person they help to be 'put down').

 

Just a thought.

 

I wouldn't put it quite as crudely as that,but as someone who is of a certain age I have often thought I would like the choice of assisted suicide (with no recriminations) as an alternative to a long slow and painful death.I would not accept treatment that may prolong my life by 2 or 3 months.

[mj.scuba]

As the Government is keen to completely dismantle the welfare state, destroy the NHS via the back door and devalue the pound using more QE (with the inevitable effect of hyper-inflation) life is literally going to become unsustainable for the poorest most vulnerable people in society. With the current closure of care homes, massive reduction of provision for social care in the community and the targetting of the disabled to 'get a job' when there is no realistic prospect that they would be taken on by anybody even if there were jobs out there (never mind what other horrors await with the coming cuts) people are going to be driven to such levels of despair that they would rather be dead.

 

Given that all people on welfare are being viciously been attacked from all quarters as 'parasites' why does the Government not set up a programme where they can be get rid of once and for all? I'm sure the ConDems would be ecstatic to see them go (and probably offer incentives to the likes of Atos for each person they help to be 'put down').

 

Just a thought.

 

You should be in the Government.

[msmouse]

I wouldn't put it quite as crudely as that,but as someone who is of a certain age I have often thought I would like the choice of assisted suicide (with no recriminations) as an alternative to a long slow and painful death.I would not accept treatment that may prolong my life by 2 or 3 months.

 

Sorry. I didn't mean to be crude. Admittedly my OP was a tad flippant but it's actually quite a serious question. I'm not advocating any kind of compulsory scheme as that would be tantamount to genocide, but I would like to see the option of a dignified recrimination free alternative to starving to death in a freezing home in complete isolation (that's if you're lucky enough to have a roof over your head, as the rather tasteless 'Tramps' thread demonstrates what happens to many people with serious mental health problems).

 

The legacy left by "there's no such thing as society" Thatcher has led to a disintegration of communities and many people are truly alone in life with no friends or family to support them. It is totally ironic that Cameron is now relying on the 'Big Society' to replace any form of safety net that vulnerable individuals rely on. This simply will not work in practice as we now live in a selfish 'survial of the fittest' world which is only going to be made worse under this administration.

 

I'm fully aware that the country has been left in an untenable financial position, with the deficit being a mere flea on the dog's back of debt that has being racked up. We are in serious danger of total financial collapse which Ken Clarke warned about last week, so even if we do manage to reduce the deficit we are still up to our neck in debt.

 

I don't have any answers as to what to do as the Government seems to be merely tinkering around the edges of cutting most departments, with the DWP picking up most of the burden. We ought to look more at defence/overseas aid and any other area where we have ridiculous pretensions about our place in the world. Also, the only real way out is to start exporting because any other activity in the economy (apart from the financial services sector, which had a part to play in this mess) is simply recycling debt. The Forgemasters case is a classic example of how this Government does not seem to be capable of getting it's priorities right. Vince Cable has now admitted that it was a mistake to deny the loan and that every pound invested would have actually seen a return of three pounds. It's an area where we could have become a world leader with Japan currently having the only capability of rivalling what the Forgemasters loan would have enabled us to do. It is interesting that now we have dropped the baton in this technology Germany has decided to build it's own facility for this highly lucrative area, which it said it would not have proceeded with if we had decided to go ahead.

 

I know I've gone slightly off topic here, but the fact is that any civilised society is ultimately judged by how it treats it's most vulnerable members. If we can't afford to offer any kind of tolerable existence to these people and they would rather be dead than live a life of unutterable misery and hardship then I think they should be legally helped to be put out of thier misery if they so wish. As bad as this may seem, perhaps it's the most 'civilised' thing to do unless you have any alternative suggestions?

 

As a final point, I actually fall into the category of 'vulnerable person' and am in a state of complete despair about the bleak future we seem to be facing. I would like to have the option of a dignified 'way out' if living becomes as intolerable as I fear it will.

[Tradescanthia]

As the Government is keen to completely dismantle the welfare state, destroy the NHS via the back door and devalue the pound using more QE (with the inevitable effect of hyper-inflation) life is literally going to become unsustainable for the poorest most vulnerable people in society. With the current closure of care homes, massive reduction of provision for social care in the community and the targetting of the disabled to 'get a job' when there is no realistic prospect that they would be taken on by anybody even if there were jobs out there (never mind what other horrors await with the coming cuts) people are going to be driven to such levels of despair that they would rather be dead.

 

Given that all people on welfare are being viciously been attacked from all quarters as 'parasites' why does the Government not set up a programme where they can be get rid of once and for all? I'm sure the ConDems would be ecstatic to see them go (and probably offer incentives to the likes of Atos for each person they help to be 'put down').

 

Just a thought.

 

POST OF THE WEEK !!!!!!! I applaud thee my friend.:clap::clap:

[Mecky]

Logans Run

[purdyamos]

 

I know I've gone slightly off topic here, but the fact is that any civilised society is ultimately judged by how it treats it's most vulnerable members. If we can't afford to offer any kind of tolerable existence to these people and they would rather be dead than live a life of unutterable misery and hardship then I think they should be legally helped to be put out of thier misery if they so wish. As bad as this may seem, perhaps it's the most 'civilised' thing to do unless you have any alternative suggestions?

 

 

This week I tried to highlight several times the absence of any properly functioning mental health service for those at the intense and unfashionable end of the spectrum. All I did was kill each thread stone dead. People think there are basically adequate services out there. People don't realize that in real terms there are close to none. Only people in the emergency services know how truly inadequate the 'mental health services' are and what are the consequences of that.

 

People don't give a toss. People think it's nothing to do with them, that it doesn't affect their own lives. They're too myopic to see that the decimation of the services that used to exist have simply created more complex and ugly problems for society. The only answer they have is to hate and blame the very people who are most vulnerable, for being vulnerable in the first place. Even most people on the left don't care. Even those workers left in the skeleton of the service that's left don't care anymore.

 

The problem with making cuts in this sector is that there have already been such savage cuts, there's almost nothing left to cut. I've made jokes in the past about mobile gas vans to solve the problem but most people are even too ignorant of history to understand the reference. (Clue - Godwin alert!!) Or more correctly, they just couldn't give damn.

 

I had surgery for something very common a couple of years ago. What it did was show to me just how atrocious the 'mental health service' had become in comparison with physical health provision, and how deep the schism in the attitude of the general public (and even many staff) between physical and mental illness. The difference is like 'good AIDS' and 'bad AIDS'.

 

It's hard enough to deal with serious illness with barely any professional support and no family, but when you add in the deluge of socially sanctioned scapegoating and condemnation I do wonder how anyone expects those at the very bottom to find the confidence and self-belief to even make the effort.

 

I'm sorry if I've killed another thread.

[Suffragette1]

This week I tried to highlight several times the absence of any properly functioning mental health service for those at the intense and unfashionable end of the spectrum. All I did was kill each thread stone dead. People think there are basically adequate services out there. People don't realize that in real terms there are close to none. Only people in the emergency services know how truly inadequate the 'mental health services' are and what are the consequences of that.

 

People don't give a toss. People think it's nothing to do with them, that it doesn't affect their own lives. They're too myopic to see that the decimation of the services that used to exist have simply created more complex and ugly problems for society. The only answer they have is to hate and blame the very people who are most vulnerable, for being vulnerable in the first place. Even most people on the left don't care. Even those workers left in the skeleton of the service that's left don't care anymore.

 

The problem with making cuts in this sector is that there have already been such savage cuts, there's almost nothing left to cut. I've made jokes in the past about mobile gas vans to solve the problem but most people are even too ignorant of history to understand the reference. (Clue - Godwin alert!!) Or more correctly, they just couldn't give damn.

 

I had surgery for something very common a couple of years ago. What it did was show to me just how atrocious the 'mental health service' had become in comparison with physical health provision, and how deep the schism in the attitude of the general public (and even many staff) between physical and mental illness. The difference is like 'good AIDS' and 'bad AIDS'.

 

It's hard enough to deal with serious illness with barely any professional support and no family, but when you add in the deluge of socially sanctioned scapegoating and condemnation I do wonder how anyone expects those at the very bottom to find the confidence and self-belief to even make the effort.

 

I'm sorry if I've killed another thread.

 

Not dead - well not yet, anyway.

 

Everything that you say is true and I have nothing further to add, except that voluntary organisations and charities such as Samaritans and MIND are propping up the mental health service (such as it is) and they are literally a lifeline to those most vulnerable to these cuts. I have friends who work in CAMHS and other areas of the NHS providing a much needed for service, whose departments are being decimated.

[chem1st]

Euthanasia needs to be legalised, but it should not be forced.

 

Besides, they can cut the winter fuel grant if they want to off the old people. (or ruin christmas - as most OAPs spend the money on xmas presents or holidays)