A muslim world?

[Grahame]

Three is a crowd.

 

Very true, and now the Muslims have more or less taken control of Jerusalem.

[plekhanov]

Jerusalem belonged to the Jews many of whom became Christians. Then came the Muslims and that is when the trouble started.

Yeah because the Middle East was such a trouble free place before those nasty Muslims spoiled it all in the 7th Century

 

I mean it certainly hasn't been fought over by tribes & empires going back into pre-history or anything. The Jewish diaspora for example which of course predates the invention of Islam and which the current 'troubles' can in many ways be traced back to was totally peaceful in origin

[Grahame]

Yeah because the Middle East was such a trouble free place before those nasty Muslims spoiled it all in the 7th Century

 

I mean it certainly hasn't been fought over by tribes & empires going back into pre-history or anything. The Jewish diaspora for example which of course predates the invention of Islam and which the current 'troubles' can in many ways be traced back to was totally peaceful in origin

 

Yes, Jerusalem has been fought over by the Babylonians, Persians, Greeks, Romans, Byzantines and the Ottoman Empire not to mention more recent events.

 

The important point is that rather than the wars being about religion, as some would have us believe, they have instead been about power and foreign conquest.

 

 

[boyfriday]

Then came the Muslims and that is when the trouble started.

 

So in fact that isn't when the trouble started?

 

Yes, Jerusalem has been fought over by the Babylonians, Persians, Greeks, Romans, Byzantines and the Ottoman Empire not to mention more recent events.

 

The important point is that rather than the wars being about religion, as some would have us believe, they have instead been about power and foreign conquest.

[Grahame]

So in fact that isn't when the trouble started?

 

As far as religion was concerned it was the Muslims who caused trouble by not allowing Christian pilgrims access to the Holy Land.

 

Did you not read my second sentence. "The important point is that rather than the wars being about religion, as some would have us believe, they have instead been about power and foreign conquest."

[plekhanov]

Yes, Jerusalem has been fought over by the Babylonians, Persians, Greeks, Romans, Byzantines and the Ottoman Empire not to mention more recent events.

 

The important point is that rather than the wars being about religion, as some would have us believe, they have instead been about power and foreign conquest.

I must say I'm a little confused, in your previous post you declared that the wars (including confusingly the wars which occurred millennia before Islam was made up) were due to one specific religion yet now you declare that they aren't about religion at all.

 

You can't have it both ways either religion (Islam included) is blameless or religion takes at least some of the blame. Though I must confess that 'militant' atheist as I am not even I can see how Islam can be blamed for wars which precede its invention by thousands of years.

[Halibut]

As far as religion was concerned it was the Muslims who caused trouble by not allowing Christian pilgrims access to the Holy Land.

 

Did you not read my second sentence. "The important point is that rather than the wars being about religion, as some would have us believe, they have instead been about power and foreign conquest."

 

For God's sake. It's pathetic - theism reduced to playground squabbling.

[plekhanov]

For God's sake. It's pathetic - theism reduced to playground squabbling.

"Reduced"?

[Halibut]

"Reduced"?

 

Yes, I chose the word carefully.

[boyfriday]

As far as religion was concerned it was the Muslims who caused trouble by not allowing Christian pilgrims access to the Holy Land.

 

Did you not read my second sentence. "The important point is that rather than the wars being about religion, as some would have us believe, they have instead been about power and foreign conquest."

 

..so in fact it didn't start with Islam, which is what you originally said-it was about power and foreign conquest, which had been going on for years before that.