BBC Panorama 22/11/10 - Muslims kids getting hate lessons in UK

[quisquose]

Just watched this, and have to say that it was much as I expected. The headline grabbing stuff about weekend schools and Saudi textbooks only occupied the last 10 mins of the programme, and doesn't really concern me that much. There are all sorts of nasty views held by people from all backgrounds, and it's a sad reality that these people will always be determined to infect their children with the same idiotic views.

 

But in terms of broader social impact, what’s happening in parts of the wider Islamic education sector is far worse. Unfortunately in many of these schools, the state is failing to provide adequate education, and is unwilling to regulate or even understand the alternative provision that has grown up.

 

The sight of a classroom full of girls wearing compulsory niqabs made me feel quite upset.

 

[Suffragette1]

Just watched this, and have to say that it was much as I expected. The headline grabbing stuff about weekend schools and Saudi textbooks only occupied the last 10 mins of the programme, and doesn't really concern me that much. There are all sorts of nasty views held by people from all backgrounds, and it's a sad reality that these people will always be determined to infect their children with the same idiotic views.

 

But in terms of broader social impact, what’s happening in parts of the wider Islamic education sector is far worse. Unfortunately in many of these schools, the state is failing to provide adequate education, and is unwilling to regulate or even understand the alternative provision that has grown up.

 

The sight of a classroom full of girls wearing compulsory niqabs made me feel quite upset.

 

Same here, and worn from the age of 11 so the commentary said (and if I recall correctly). I was also aghast to hear the teaching about the role of women and how they should really be confined to the home and only leave the house when necessary.

[Plain Talker]

Just watched this, and have to say that it was much as I expected. The headline grabbing stuff about weekend schools and Saudi textbooks only occupied the last 10 mins of the programme, and doesn't really concern me that much. There are all sorts of nasty views held by people from all backgrounds, and it's a sad reality that these people will always be determined to infect their children with the same idiotic views.

 

But in terms of broader social impact, what’s happening in parts of the wider Islamic education sector is far worse. Unfortunately in many of these schools, the state is failing to provide adequate education, and is unwilling to regulate or even understand the alternative provision that has grown up.

 

The sight of a classroom full of girls wearing compulsory niqabs made me feel quite upset.

 

 

The main problem with this is that it's the Wahabist idiots bringing these barmy ideas in, not the ordinary mainstream Muslim. Most mainstream Muslims consider the Wahabists to be "that side" of extreme. (*points into the distance*)

 

I agree with your point about the girls and the niqaabs. The niqaab should be the individual's choice, and not forced on anyone, particularly children (who, incidentally, until they are of age, don't need to "cover" whatever level the individual decides to take that to)

[Plain Talker]

Same here, and worn from the age of 11 so the commentary said (and if I recall correctly). I was also aghast to hear the teaching about the role of women and how they should really be confined to the home and only leave the house when necessary.

 

Again, that appals me, too. That teaching is contrary to Islam. A woman is permitted to work, own property, run her own business and is obliged to be educated to the extent of her capabilities. How can she do this if confined to the home?

[Suffragette1]

You don't say

 

I guess it would be too challenging for you to separate the activities of Muslim extremists from Muslims generally?

 

Tell me, do you believe the unruly elements of the EDL is representative of white folks?

 

Why do we always end up having this stupid argument and going totally off topic into a row about extremists vs everyone else? This is not aimed at you by the way, but it happens every time without fail. People are so dense, this is not about Muslims per se it's about extremism.

 

If I criticise patriarchy or misogynists and people automatically assume that I must therefore by definition be a misandrist, then I really can't be bothered to engage with them as it shows how stupid and facile they are.

[donkey]

Why do we always end up having this stupid argument and going totally off topic into a row about extremists vs everyone else? This is not aimed at you by the way, but it happens every time without fail. People are so dense, this is not about Muslims per se it's about extremism.

If I criticise patriarchy or misogynists and people automatically assume that I must therefore by definition be a misandrist, then I really can't be bothered to engage with them as it shows how stupid and facile they are.

 

That's outrageous. I hope you set them straight that you not a Miss or Mrs andrist, you are a Ms andrist. (whatever that might be)

[melthebell]

Why do we always end up having this stupid argument and going totally off topic into a row about extremists vs everyone else? This is not aimed at you by the way, but it happens every time without fail. People are so dense, this is not about Muslims per se it's about extremism.

 

If I criticise patriarchy or misogynists and people automatically assume that I must therefore by definition be a misandrist, then I really can't be bothered to engage with them as it shows how stupid and facile they are.

 

but thats the point

the programme was about extremists

 

BUT

 

you read back to the majority of this thread, yet again its just another muslim bashing thread, some people just CANNOT diffrentiate between a muslim and an extremist, BF just made the point that should all white folk be classed as similer to the EDL (them being extremists, AND the majority white)

[Suffragette1]

but thats the point

the programme was about extremists

 

BUT

 

you read back to the majority of this thread, yet again its just another muslim bashing thread, some people just CANNOT diffrentiate between a muslim and an extremist, BF just made the point that should all white folk be classed as similer to the EDL (them being extremists, AND the majority white)

 

I'd take it one step further and say that they cannot differentiate between a person and a belief system which is a distillation of extremism.

[Suffragette1]

That's outrageous. I hope you set them straight that you not a Miss or Mrs andrist, you are a Ms andrist. (whatever that might be)

 

Quite, I like it msandrist™(Donkey), you've just coined a new term.

[boyfriday]

Why do we always end up having this stupid argument and going totally off topic into a row about extremists vs everyone else? This is not aimed at you by the way, but it happens every time without fail. People are so dense, this is not about Muslims per se it's about extremism.

 

If I criticise patriarchy or misogynists and people automatically assume that I must therefore by definition be a misandrist, then I really can't be bothered to engage with them as it shows how stupid and facile they are.

 

It's a necessary evil Im afraid Suffy because some people are unable to confine themselves to the issue and people at hand.

 

Obelix drew an analogy about the KKK earlier, you can imagine the righteous indignation if Muslims tried to claim that white folks were all cross burners.

 

It shouldn't need pointing out that such generalisations are misguided but it needs nailing every time they arise because they will slip into the public consciousness otherwise.