Smoking establishments - Debate, not abuse.

[alex3659]

Smoking or not smoking, pubs these days are full of unruly children who's parents couldn't give a flying. And the breweries don't help by advertising two meals for a fiver etc; pubs full of tight fisted farts spending bugger all.

 

£2.80 for a pint of anything decent, and £5.00 odd per large glass of wine has slowed down our pub visits no end. This coupled with the smoking ban saw me more or less give pubs the elbow prior to me stopping smoking in May of this year.

 

That post is spot on.

My local £2.95 for carling, £5 for aglass of half decent wine, you feel like you have been mugged the next morning.

Kids running about while parents get slashed is a disgrace but a common sight nowadays.

[carosio]

pubs full of tight fisted farts spending bugger all.

 

£2.80 for a pint of anything decent, and £5.00 odd per large glass of wine has slowed down our pub visits no end. This coupled with the smoking ban saw me more or less give pubs the elbow prior to me stopping smoking in May of this year.

Is one obliged to spend anything when visiting a public house? Can't I just sit there and read the paper all evening, or could I get barred?

 

Between them, the government and the breweries have wrecked the viability of the traditional pub, along with high running costs such as heating, business rates etc.

[Guest]

Good luck with that.

 

It seems I need quite a bit more than good luck.

[Guest]

Problems with introducing smoking pubs:

 

1. In small villages where there is only one pub

 

2. In small villages where there are two pubs and both wish to remain either one or the other.

 

3. Extraction- powerful extraction systems create problems such as strong draughts, the air going out has to be balanced by air coming in and this has to be catered for, not easy in most buildings, and expensive, not to mention the extra heating cost.

 

1 - I do agree there would be a problem in those circumstances

2 - I also agree that could be a problem too.

Maybe a village would not be so small that it could stand the possibility of a third pub.

3 - In modern sophisticated Air Conditioning Systems, the main intake /output mechanism is not actually in the rooms where the air is ducted too / drawn from - it would be situated in it's own small air con room in the same way that the systems operate in the giant modern office blocks & skyscrapers - usually found on the roof.

 

Were it necessary to charge slightly more for the drinks to help cover any extra expense, I'm sure that most smokers would be willing to pay the premium for their own enjoyment - just in the same way that pubs always charged more than working men's clubs but still got customers who were willing to pay more and drink in a traditional pub.

 

A reasonable response from you anyway, and I do agree that the first (and probably the second) scenario you raise would be problematic.

[Guest]

And many people have to visit pubs besides those that want to drink there. Why should they be subjected to seconhand smoke?

 

I don't know who you are referring to I'm afraid - do you mean such people as maintenance staff, delivery men etc?

 

If so, they would be covered by the present rules for all working establishments and so, delivery men, for instance, wouldn't enter the public area - they usually use a separate door to the cellars anyway.

 

Workers such as cleaners, electricians, plumbers etc. would work before or after normal opening hours, much as they do now.

 

It goes without saying that it would be paramount that no one but the smokers, the smoking staff or other customers who insisted on using it by choice, in spite of the warning notices, would have to endure the secondhand smoke.

[beer]

I don't know who you are referring to I'm afraid - do you mean such people as maintenance staff, delivery men etc?

 

If so, they would be covered by the present rules for all working establishments and so, delivery men, for instance, wouldn't enter the public area - they usually use a separate door to the cellars anyway.

 

Workers such as cleaners, electricians, plumbers etc. would work before or after normal opening hours, much as they do now.

 

It goes without saying that it would be paramount that no one but the smokers, the smoking staff or other customers who insisted on using it by choice, in spite of the warning notices, would have to endure the secondhand smoke.

 

That's all very well but carbon monoxide lingers around as do all the other toxins, so folks who are required to visit licenced premises would still face the same danger as those in the bar.

There is an even bigger problem though. You say that these places would be strictly smokers only. Nice.. That is rather descriminatory. Its a bit like saying men only, women only, no Jews or Irish. I think you are still living in the 1950s.

[Guest]

Smoking or not smoking, pubs these days are full of unruly children who's parents couldn't give a flying. And the breweries don't help by advertising two meals for a fiver etc; pubs full of tight fisted farts spending bugger all.

 

£2.80 for a pint of anything decent, and £5.00 odd per large glass of wine has slowed down our pub visits no end. This coupled with the smoking ban saw me more or less give pubs the elbow prior to me stopping smoking in May of this year.

 

I fully agree with you but, unfortunately, don't know what can be done about it.

The fault lies with the breweries and some changed government legislation - I'm afraid the government are unlikely to lean on the breweries so all people can do really is support the few traditional pubs which still exist and make sure the type of pub you are referring never gets your custom.

 

There are many who think along these lines and this, together with the smoking legislation explains the many closed down pubs. Unfortunately, there are also many of these families with unruly kids who will support them so market forces will prevail and the good old pubs we remember with great affection may all disappear forever.

[Guest]

Exactly, but I was trying to answer Organgrinders appeal for suggestions as to the practicalities of introducing an (hypothetical) alternative choice for smokers, based, presumably, on the existing pubs available.

 

Yes, many people visit pubs in the course of their business, including entertainers, DJs, etc, all of which have to be considered.

 

 

Just come across your post and I have to admit that I hadn't considered it from the entertainment angle which is a major slip because that's exactly what I used to do for many years - hence, ORGANgrinder.

 

However, that would not be problematic because many entertainers smoke and would be quite happy, if not absolutely delighted, to work in a smoking pub again.

 

A good point anyway, but not a problem.

[Guest]

That post is spot on.

My local £2.95 for carling, £5 for aglass of half decent wine, you feel like you have been mugged the next morning.

Kids running about while parents get slashed is a disgrace but a common sight nowadays.

 

You will see that I have already answered crookesey on this point and said that I also feel the same.

 

If it's any consolation, a smoking establishment such as I envisage would naturally NOT allow kids inside and would be more like the pubs of the olden days.

It could still have one no smoking room (as a very few of the old pubs did) but , due to the nature of the business, children would definitely not be allowed.

 

I'm afraid that little could be done about pricing - I personally, would prefer to pay a small premium on the price (if they didn't get too carried away) to enjoy the type of pub which I like

[Guest]

Is one obliged to spend anything when visiting a public house? Can't I just sit there and read the paper all evening, or could I get barred?

 

Between them, the government and the breweries have wrecked the viability of the traditional pub, along with high running costs such as heating, business rates etc.

 

I hadn't envisaged questions of this sort so I can't say that I have a ready made answer.

In my experience, and I have worked at a lot of pubs, both behind the bar and entertaining, I don't think I ever remember that situation arising.

I certainly don't recall anyone being shown the door for not buying drinks (or a meal) but most businesses such as cafes etc would not allow you to use the premises if you were not a paying customer.

 

So either no, you couldn't do that, or maybe allow it at the managers discretion.