Why are you, you?

[spooky3]

So do you think you are a black or white thinker?

 

As I said, "I'm very binary".

[spooky3]

Trained... Learned yes, trained I don't think so. But does that make any difference? How about next time you scratch an itch. How about next time you duck a snowball. It's more difficult to find non physical examples, but a lot of our behaviour comes from below the conscious mind and we retrofit it into our conscious model as having decided to take that action.

It's different if you pause before the action, think about it and then take action, although the brain scans still the 'decision' being made up to 0.5 seconds before you can express it in any way!

 

Trained / learned, basically same thing. Taught response.

 

You don't have to scratch an itch, you can teach yourself to resist the urge (natural instinct).

 

How many toddlers duck a snowball first time? (one's which haven't previously played, say ball games, for that matter how many try to catch the snowball?)

 

 

As for the 0.5 second prior reaction thing, read the last paper provided by Phanerothyme it sort of defeats itself. Also as I said there are flaws in the experiments in my opinion. Let's face it i've been locking my front door for years, then they just kicked it off instead! The only bit about the 0.5 seconds is that is how long it takes for that specific signal to transfer, however in the test outlined, there were other signal inputs unconsidered in my opinion! Never mind the expectation just from being in a test!

[llamatron]

I think I am me mainly because of the books I have read and the music I have listened to.

 

I am too romantic yet at the same time too cynical, I wait for the knight in shining armour but expect him never to appear!

 

I think there were too many fictional happy endings and factual dissapointments in my life!

 

[Phanerothyme]

As for the 0.5 second prior reaction thing, read the last paper provided by Phanerothyme it sort of defeats itself. Also as I said there are flaws in the experiments in my opinion. Let's face it i've been locking my front door for years, then they just kicked it off instead! The only bit about the 0.5 seconds is that is how long it takes for that specific signal to transfer, however in the test outlined, there were other signal inputs unconsidered in my opinion! Never mind the expectation just from being in a test!

 

I included all the papers so you can follow the reasoning.

 

Although Libet's conclusions have been effectively superceded, the antedating of experience in the conscious mind is an interesting topic, and his research still reveals huge gaps in knowledge, which is a good thing.

 

I fastened on to Libet's original results, because they were so counter-intuitive and thought provoking.

 

At the moment, even given the last article, we're a long way from brain theory, let alone mind theory.

 

Which gives people like me plenty of time to theorise, speculate and play with ideas of what constitutes consciousness.

 

After all, it's one thing we all have, and are able to experiment upon at will with complete ethical oversight!

[espadrille]

As I said, "I'm very binary".

 

Ok

 

This is the definition of binary.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/binary

 

I am asking if you are a black or white thinker.That is a question that is different to the answer that you gave.

[spooky3]

Ok

 

This is the definition of binary.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/binary

 

I am asking if you are a black or white thinker.That is a question that is different to the answer that you gave.

 

Binary...

1. Characterized by or consisting of two parts or components; twofold.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/binary

 

e.g.

0 / 1

true / false

positive / negative

yes, / no

on / off

in / out

black / white

green / red

 

etc...

 

So, if I understand your terms (i.e. fits to the patterns indicated above), then yes.

 

I'm a bit of a Spock really!

 

However I do not only use binary logic, I also study things in terms of fuzzy logic, I like to quantise data.

 

P.S. I'm not as weird as that sounds, most people who meet me don't even realise that i'm a nerd!

[Cyclone]

Trained / learned, basically same thing. Taught response.

Not quite, trained implies external teaching, learned can be independent.

 

You don't have to scratch an itch, you can teach yourself to resist the urge (natural instinct).

You're playing with words to avoid the question. You scratch an itch without conscious thought most of the time, it's an example of how you integrate your decisions into your consciousness after they've happened. The scratching just has a physical component that makes it obvious.

 

How many toddlers duck a snowball first time? (one's which haven't previously played, say ball games, for that matter how many try to catch the snowball?)

 

 

As for the 0.5 second prior reaction thing, read the last paper provided by Phanerothyme it sort of defeats itself. Also as I said there are flaws in the experiments in my opinion. Let's face it i've been locking my front door for years, then they just kicked it off instead! The only bit about the 0.5 seconds is that is how long it takes for that specific signal to transfer, however in the test outlined, there were other signal inputs unconsidered in my opinion! Never mind the expectation just from being in a test!

I wasn't claiming that it was definitely correct or the be all and end all of consciousness research, just explaining where Phan was coming from.

[Cyclone]

Ok

 

This is the definition of binary.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/binary

 

I am asking if you are a black or white thinker.That is a question that is different to the answer that you gave.

 

Someone who was just one, would surely be a uniary thinker... A binary thinker flips between the two possible states. Personally I like to consider all the shades of grey, up to a 16 bit pallet I think, beyond that and you're splitting hairs

[espadrille]

Someone who was just one, would surely be a uniary thinker... A binary thinker flips between the two possible states. Personally I like to consider all the shades of grey, up to a 16 bit pallet I think, beyond that and you're splitting hairs

 

I have taught myself to consider shades of gray.However, I would say that naturally I am a black or white thinker.You can either do it or you cant as an eg.

Situations/things are usually somewhere in between my black/white thinking so I am now able to realize this but it has taken years of analytical thinking to get me on this track.

However I have always been good at seeing both sides of a story, but I must admit I am struggling on this thread!!

[spooky3]

You're playing with words to avoid the question. You scratch an itch without conscious thought most of the time, it's an example of how you integrate your decisions into your consciousness after they've happened. The scratching just has a physical component that makes it obvious.

 

 

I wasn't trying to. It's all concious thought, even instinct is. We do have certain physical autonomic reactions such as blinking. It's just sometimes certain thoughts are so slight that they appear oblivious, until your in a situation where you can't respond as normal, e.g. broke your arm, within a week you won't even be flinching that arm to scratch with.

 

I wasn't claiming that it was definitely correct or the be all and end all of consciousness research, just explaining where Phan was coming from.

 

There's credit to it, but it has some serious flaws in it. The studies are quite old using old technology, the newer experiments proved as much, but still the parameters of the experiment voids it, e.g. see when I posted about Schrödinger's cat.