Should Terry Jones be banned from the UK

[flamingjimmy]

“We’re concerned that the images from the burning of a Quran would be used in the same way that extremists used images from Abu Ghraib — that they would in a sense be indelible,” Petraeus told NBC’s Brian Williams. “They would be used by those who wish us ill, to incite violence and to enflame public opinion against us and against our mission here in Afghanistan, as well as our missions undoubtedly around the world.”

 

I agree with General Petraeus, it seems Pastor Jones's actions are getting a violent response.

 

OK, so that's a very loose and flimsy justification for you claiming he aided 'the enemy'.

 

Now how about you justify your claim he also abetted them?

 

Also, I noticed you've now dropped your analogy, presumably in response to my pointing out how it wasn't appropriate. I think danot came up with a better one earlier:

 

If Jones became angered by the burning of the American flag during islamic demonatrations, went out and murdered a couple of innocent muslim to express his anger, would the demonstraters have aided and abetted him?

 

Any chance you could riddle me that one please?

 

EDIT: Also, please try to use the quote system properly

[Phanerothyme]

No they haven't, stop abusing the English language. His actions neither aided nor abetted 'the enemy' (whoever you mean by that).

 

He's deliberately provided islamic militants with propaganda that will be effective (like the Abu Ghraib images) in stoking resentment and hatred of people trying to do an impossible job in a dangerous country.

 

I'm sure the islamic militants will be grateful for that kind of help in winning their battle for hearts and minds.

 

He's doing the equivalent of the wannabe jihadiots© who burn flags and shout "Death to Amreeka" - i.e. giving ammunition to the haters.

 

Not entirely sure you know the meaning of "abet" either.

[Collingwood]

OK, so that's a very loose and flimsy justification for you claiming he aided 'the enemy'.

 

I agree with what the United States general says, he must have his finger on the pulse.

 

EDIT: Also, please try to use the quote system properly

 

Be a bit more charitable, I'm still finding my way around on here.

[mj.scuba]

If Jones became angered by the burning of the American flag during islamic demonatrations, went out and murdered a couple of innocent muslim to express his anger, would the demonstraters have aided and abetted him?

 

That's far too much of a logical and rational way to put it and for people to understand.

 

But he's the American, so it must be his fault.

 

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[flamingjimmy]

He's deliberately provided islamic militants with propaganda that will be effective (like the Abu Ghraib images) in stoking resentment and hatred of people trying to do an impossible job in a dangerous country.

 

I'm sure the islamic militants will be grateful for that kind of help in winning their battle for hearts and minds.

Yes, which is why I conceded that point.

 

Not entirely sure you know the meaning of "abet" either.

Nor was I for a second when I read that, a quick check though and it turns out that I do and that I was right.

 

He's doing the equivalent of the wannabe jihadiots© who burn flags and shout "Death to Amreeka" -

I agree. Perhaps you could answer Danot's hypothetical question then?

 

"If Jones became angered by the burning of the American flag during islamic demonatrations, went out and murdered a couple of innocent muslim to express his anger, would the demonstraters have aided and abetted him?"

[flamingjimmy]

Be a bit more charitable, I'm still finding my way around on here.

 

Perhaps I might've been if you didn't keep rudely ignoring the points I was making, like you have done again here.

[Phanerothyme]

Yes, which is why I conceded that point.

 

Nor was I for a second when I read that, a quick check though and it turns out that I do and that I was right.

Well, ok then. I would say that abet is synonymous with incite, more or less. You would obviously disagree and adhere to the legal definition used in "aiding and abetting". Jones isn't guilty of anything illegal, that much has been thrashed out already.

I agree. Perhaps you could answer Danot's hypothetical question then?

 

"If Jones became angered by the burning of the American flag during Islamic demonstrations, went out and murdered a couple of innocent Muslim to express his anger, would the demonstrators have aided and abetted him?"

 

No they would have incited him to do it..

 

A better hypothetical would have substituted American Flag for King James Bible, as that's more directly analogous.

 

Just as he actually and deliberately attempted (successfully) to incite religious hatred.

 

It's like when we, as a nation, incite violence against our own citizens. The responsibility for the attacks rests entirely with the attackers, but the responsibility for creating an atmosphere and culture where the attackers feel they can act, lies entirely with us.

[Harleyman]

I hope that doesn't happen Harleyman but surely there's some way that the authorities in the United States can muzzle Jones

 

No there is not. If any authority were to take action against him then he'd get a lawyer and sue the heck out of that authority for violating his rights as a US citizen and he'd win. Now if he went as far as to go out and

verbally threaten Muslims with violence or paint derogatory statements on their property then he would be arrested.

 

On the subject of Muslim reaction it should be mentioned that the burning of the US flag is a daily occurence in the middle east. Apparently it's acceptable for them to disrespect a flag that Americans hold dear and a symbol of unity.

It doesn't say much for their intellect if they see every American as another Terry Jones but then again we're trying to make sense of a world that is still in the shadow of the dark ages

[danot]

That's far too much of a logical and rational way to put it and for people to understand.

 

But he's the American, so it must be his fault.

 

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They know Jones isn't to blame, but they haven't the bottle to say what they want to say- that Islam is a backward religion that has blood thirsty murdering savages killing innocent people to intimidate and deter any further protests against Islam. That's why certain SF members disaprove of Jones's antics.. because they know what Islam is.

[Sheff-Van]

The man is a fool ,deliberately trying to stir up anti-muslim feelings.

 

He should be treated for what he is ........ a bigoted fool.