spindrift Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 If you don't like people having roads; if you don't like goods being transported by road, you are very welcome to grow your own food in your very own window box and you are cordially invited to have nothing to do with any merchandise or product which has travelled by road. Are you prepared to do that? Yes there are benefits to motoring and motor transport but only with the world economy as it is currently set up with motoring, motorways and the extensive road network facilitating road haulage on a massive scale with massive logistics centres near motorways etc and the construction of massive out of town shopping centres and supermarkets with acres of parking. If these can be considered benefits. The reason our national economy functions as it does is largely down to cheap fuel and motoring. If all subsidisation of motoring was removed and motorists were left to free market economics (as rail travel is almost forced to) then the economy would change and most likely become more locally based with food and goods supplied from local producers. Or we would see a return to transport of goods and people to rail and public transport which the government would be forced to adderss properly, rather than pretending to do so as it does now. This would also massively reduce emmissions, pollution and environmental damage... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hots on Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 So fuel rising by 210% in 20 years isnt Governments hammering motorists ? Where as cyclists pay NOTHING, so please remind me who are the actual freeloaders on our roads ? I understand your frustration at fuel prices, it is a bit pricey these days, but i've got to take you up on the "freeloader" remark towards cyclists; the roads are paid for by EVERYONE, including cyclists, out of general taxation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LardyBoy Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I understand your frustration at fuel prices, it is a bit pricey these days, but i've got to take you up on the "freeloader" remark towards cyclists; the roads are paid for by EVERYONE, including cyclists, out of general taxation. Im not disputing the general taxation point . My point is that motorists pay extra to use the roads through VED , where as cyclists using the same roads are exempt from paying VED . If cyclists pay no VED , then they have no right to complain about motorists who DO pay VED. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hots on Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Yes there are benefits to motoring and motor transport but only with the world economy as it is currently set up with motoring, motorways and the extensive road network facilitating road haulage on a massive scale with massive logistics centres near motorways etc and the construction of massive out of town shopping centres and supermarkets with acres of parking. If these can be considered benefits. The reason our national economy functions as it does is largely down to cheap fuel and motoring. If all subsidisation of motoring was removed and motorists were left to free market economics (as rail travel is almost forced to) then the economy would change and most likely become more locally based with food and goods supplied from local producers. Or we would see a return to transport of goods and people to rail and public transport which the government would be forced to adderss properly, rather than pretending to do so as it does now. This would also massively reduce emmissions, pollution and environmental damage... I've been bursting to have a go at you for some of the outrages stuff you come out with on here, but that is a good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spindrift Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I understand your frustration at fuel prices, it is a bit pricey these days, but i've got to take you up on the "freeloader" remark towards cyclists; the roads are paid for by EVERYONE, including cyclists, out of general taxation. People who pay more tax contribute more to the roads (and everything else) so to follow the logic of the 'you don't pay road tax' brigade, rich people with big houses are more entitled to use the roads than poor people, and those on benefits shouldn't be allowed to use the roads or any other public service at all... Of dear, I seem to be writing this stuff for them. Plus, of course, higher earners pay more tax and cycle more than low earners. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article2500754.ece Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hots on Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Im not disputing the general taxation point . My point is that motorists pay extra to use the roads through VED , where as cyclists using the same roads are exempt from paying VED . If cyclists pay no VED , then they have no right to complain about motorists who DO pay VED. That increasingly expensive piece of circular paper in your car window isn't a "road tax", it is a tax on the type of vehicle you have and what size engine it has and its emissions....why should bicycles have to pay this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert_Baehr Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Yes there are benefits to motoring and motor transport but only with the world economy as it is currently set up with motoring, motorways and the extensive road network facilitating road haulage on a massive scale with massive logistics centres near motorways etc and the construction of massive out of town shopping centres and supermarkets with acres of parking. If these can be considered benefits. The reason our national economy functions as it does is largely down to cheap fuel and motoring. If all subsidisation of motoring was removed and motorists were left to free market economics (as rail travel is almost forced to) then the economy would change and most likely become more locally based with food and goods supplied from local producers. Or we would see a return to transport of goods and people to rail and public transport which the government would be forced to adderss properly, rather than pretending to do so as it does now. This would also massively reduce emmissions, pollution and environmental damage... People who pay more tax contribute more to the roads (and everything else) so to follow the logic of the 'you don't pay road tax' brigade, rich people with big houses are more entitled to use the roads than poor people, and those on benefits shouldn't be allowed to use the roads or any other public service at all... Of dear, I seem to be writing this stuff for them. Plus, of course, higher earners pay more tax and cycle more than low earners. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article2500754.ece But as we both know, Spinny, you do have to encourage the masses. We high earners may cycle more (in your case) or walk more (in mine) but the plebs still have to get to work and given the lack of adequate public transport, they go by car. I walk (outside snow time) about 15-25km a day. Some of it is on roads (very little) and the remainder is on paths. I ride (motorcycle) about 10,000Km a year and I drive 3-4000Km. My choice. I grow a lot of my food (and If I was forced to, I could be self-sufficient.) How about you? Could (or would) you be prepared to do without the benefits of modern society? If your wife or your daughter was taken ill, would you be happy to have an horse-drawn ambulance attend? What if the doctor lived 5 miles from the hospital and his horse couldn't get him there within an hour? He probably wouldn't have a telegraph in his house and it might take the postal boy an hour to get a message to him. - We're looking at a 2 hour response time for an emergency. Is that acceptable? If you don't want the downside of speedy and efficient road traffic, are you prepared to live with the consequences? I doubt it. Could the average Sheffielder earn enough money (could he get to work and do so) without a car?) - Again, I doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bikertec Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 We can start doing something about here. http://www.fuelprotest.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manofstrad Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 The price of fuel keeps rising, consumers keep consuming and the moaning continues. There is a way to ease the personal financial burden...... stop using your vehicle unnecassarily, it is blindingly obvious. Walk, cycle or take the bus. Why not ditch the car all together, sell it, get rid. You really don't need it. Make the world a cleaner, healthier place to live. Don't just think about it, do it. Do it now. Feel good about yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hots on Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 The price of fuel keeps rising, consumers keep consuming and the moaning continues. There is a way to ease the personal financial burden...... stop using your vehicle unnecassarily, it is blindingly obvious. Walk, cycle Done that or take the bus. . ooo no, way too expensive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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