ScoobySnack Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 The argument about Council Tax cracks me up but most specifically the cries of people that use rises in VAT etc etc as justifications for leaving well alone! I am a Council worker and I am willing to bet that a significant number of the people on this thread making this argument will be the same ones who believe that people like me should accept job and pay cuts because we, "do f**k all, are overpaid and have gold-plated pensions!" well, Newsflash! We're also affected by VAT! We're also paying fuel increases! We all struggle to pay the bills and we've all seen the value of our wages fall over the last 10 years (not just over 2 or 3 years like many posters working in the Private Sector.) Council Tax increases are a red herring designed to get you all hot and bothered as you worry about the value of your home. the reality is, in Doncaster, that every 1% increase in CT delivers only £900k to the Council's coffers - or approx £3 for every man, woman and child! The reason for this is straightforward - Central Government provide the vast bulk of the funding through direct grants to local authorities. So the Council Tax you pay bears very little relationship to the services you receive and their true cost. What this means, simply, is that if you had to pay direct for everything you use (and only what you use) you would very quickly see your costs rise substantially. The only answer to this problem is to introduce progressive taxation where the wealthy pay more and, if you want more local control, supplement this with a local income tax also. Finally, for god's sake, stop all the crap about, "I don't use Council services!" YES YOU DO! To claim that you don't simply paints a big, "cretin," mark on your forehead! When it snowed did you rely on gritters? What about parks and public spaces? Street cleaning anyone? What about street lighting? Schools? Swimming pools and leisure facilities? What about libraries and on and on! Jesus, this is before we even get on to the hard end of child protection, support for the most vulnerable, the elderly etc! If you don't think you use Council services, do us all a favour; sod off and live in splendid isolation for a few months and then come back, start a new thread and tell us all how smashing your lIfe has been. There is no question that Councils are big, clunky, frustrating and often bureaucratic organisations but, again, I am willIng to bet that the vast majority of people would quickly recognise that their lives and the lives of their children, communities etc would be a lot more bleak and fragile without them. Unless, of course, you have the money to live like a king over the great unwashed masses! If you have, you should pay more. But let's go further - you should be ashamed that you don't pay more! Any hoo! Rant over - please accept my apologies; I have been eating too much sugar! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strikerPaul Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Well it is completely daft to be honest. It its based upon a 2 decades old valuation. When considering inflation, and the initial valuations and the council tax bands. And the current property average, it is completely ludicrous that most Sheffield properties are Band A, with the next largest amounts band B and C. You would expect most to be Band D with some above and some below. It doesn't appear to have much to do with either. Yes but the only thing that inflates are things 'we' the tax payer has to pay out for. Inflation in realtion to wages never rises at anything like the rate of these things. Two examples this time last year Ponds Forge charged £7.50 for 45 minutes usage of a badminton court this years its £9.75. Thats approx a 20% increase? A big boiler firm I recently called out admitted that their cost for manufacturing a particular part was £75. A self employed plumber told me if I had requested him to purchase and install the part it would have been £650, £550 being the price of the part. Is that justified? The private sector will eventually out price the majority of the public, then complain sales are down. Not quite, but nearly on par with the banks who got a tax payer 'bail out' loan then charge us to borrow our own money back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloridaBird Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 And there's the rub. Who is to say what a property is worth? (and please don't suggest putting the work in the hands of estate agents - they haven't got a clue). I would never suggest an estate agent should value a property that is not what they do. A fully qualified chartered surveyor is the only one qualified to do this job and the council do employ them because my partner is one of them. He actually goes into councils to put right what they haven't done in the past 10 years or so (he does doe commercial though not residential). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluevan Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 I'm not Band "A" but what i will say is why do i have to pay the same as a council tenant? I'm private, I own my home, If i want extra rubbish removing i get charged where as a council tenant gets it for free?? If your private you should pay a lower rate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike84 Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 I think I pay well over the odds for the lack of service we get from the council What would you say you need from the council that you dont get at the moment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strikerPaul Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 The argument about Council Tax cracks me up but most specifically the cries of people that use rises in VAT etc etc as justifications for leaving well alone! I am a Council worker and I am willing to bet that a significant number of the people on this thread making this argument will be the same ones who believe that people like me should accept job and pay cuts because we, "do f**k all, are overpaid and have gold-plated pensions!" well, Newsflash! We're also affected by VAT! We're also paying fuel increases! We all struggle to pay the bills and we've all seen the value of our wages fall over the last 10 years (not just over 2 or 3 years like many posters working in the Private Sector.) Council Tax increases are a red herring designed to get you all hot and bothered as you worry about the value of your home. the reality is, in Doncaster, that every 1% increase in CT delivers only £900k to the Council's coffers - or approx £3 for every man, woman and child! The reason for this is straightforward - Central Government provide the vast bulk of the funding through direct grants to local authorities. So the Council Tax you pay bears very little relationship to the services you receive and their true cost. What this means, simply, is that if you had to pay direct for everything you use (and only what you use) you would very quickly see your costs rise substantially. The only answer to this problem is to introduce progressive taxation where the wealthy pay more and, if you want more local control, supplement this with a local income tax also. Finally, for god's sake, stop all the crap about, "I don't use Council services!" YES YOU DO! To claim that you don't simply paints a big, "cretin," mark on your forehead! When it snowed did you rely on gritters? What about parks and public spaces? Street cleaning anyone? What about street lighting? Schools? Swimming pools and leisure facilities? What about libraries and on and on! Jesus, this is before we even get on to the hard end of child protection, support for the most vulnerable, the elderly etc! If you don't think you use Council services, do us all a favour; sod off and live in splendid isolation for a few months and then come back, start a new thread and tell us all how smashing your lIfe has been. There is no question that Councils are big, clunky, frustrating and often bureaucratic organisations but, again, I am willIng to bet that the vast majority of people would quickly recognise that their lives and the lives of their children, communities etc would be a lot more bleak and fragile without them. Unless, of course, you have the money to live like a king over the great unwashed masses! If you have, you should pay more. But let's go further - you should be ashamed that you don't pay more! Any hoo! Rant over - please accept my apologies; I have been eating too much sugar! Most council controlled venues/places/services are usually pretty naff though let's be fair. I work for the government too, so I'm not bias about private companies. The council do the bare minimum, and you quote very poor examples of council work too. Council involvement in relation to child welfare and vulnerable adults is appalling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyofborg Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 if there was a full revaluation then there would be about six houses in total in bands A-D. by all means revalue, but first set the bands at levels which reflect the current spread of property prices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donuticus Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 I cna't understand how the size of your house effects the level of council services you use. Surely it should be a flat fee levied for every adult in the house? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discodown Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 I cna't understand how the size of your house effects the level of council services you use. Surely it should be a flat fee levied for every adult in the house? Its meant to be a reflection of your wealth. If you own a large valuable house you can afford more council tax. Its total nonsense of course, where you live doesn't necessarily reflect how wealthy you are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donuticus Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Its meant to be a reflection of your wealth. If you own a large valuable house you can afford more council tax. Its total nonsense of course, where you live doesn't necessarily reflect how wealthy you are It just seems crazy to me. An amount per adult on the electoral roll at that address is the fairest way. Income tax is, quite rightly, increased the more you earn but why should identical council services cost people more for receiving the same service? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.