Ian Tomlinson Verdict: Unlawful Killing

[Mr Prime]

I haven't "heaped abuse" or ridiculed anyone. Nor have I threatened anyone with violence.

 

Anyway, if Harwood had followed his orders, he would not have been in a position to attack an innocent man from behind, which resulted in his death. His disobedience was the true catalyst for this whole incident.

 

You know perfectly well I am not saying you did, don't try and muddy the waters, I know your tired ways by now old one. You see fit to wag your fingers at me for being rude etc but it's OK for others who agree with you. Fancy that.

 

You called me a vile individual. Now I won't be sobbing into my pint at it but am surprised at this coming from you Obi Wan who has always condemned me for the slightest sarcasm never mind proper insults.

[evildrneil]

Yes it does for two reasons, this forum attracts single agenda hobby horses and secondly these views are very passionate and emotional and not often repeated in the conversations I have had or over heard. Like I said I have nothing against the man and his family. Many I've heard have said they are 'pikeys' or 'wasters' who 'let him get like that' or that Tomlinson was a 'waster who couldn't hold down a job and was so booze addled he was a dead man walking'.

 

Before anyone says that must just be my similar minded fascist friends I'm sorry to disappoint you. I work in a big open plan office with a fair mix of ages and backgrounds. I don't like some of the people I'm quoting and consider myself the sympathetic end of the wedge. The fact the hystericals on here can't see that is indicative of the quality of thinking that many on SF have.

 

This forum has a very wide range of participants. Yes, some may be single agenda proponents and some may be passionate but that doesn't mean that as a whole the X thousand people registered on here are not a reasonable cross section of the population of this city. Your simply citing anecdote which may or may not be either true or accurate.

[Mr Prime]

This forum has a very wide range of participants. Yes, some may be single agenda proponents and some may be passionate but that doesn't mean that as a whole the X thousand people registered on here are not a reasonable cross section of the population of this city. Your simply citing anecdote which may or may not be either true or accurate.

 

Well in my ever so humble opinion this site is more representative than most but I would not stake my life on it being a true barometer of public opinion. In the real world most people have had a view that Tomlinson's death was a tragedy mainly caused by his state of health and not a coppers push.

[evildrneil]

No I haven't. There are no disparaging remarks about the man himself unless you are changing the meaning of disparaging.

 

You wouldn't say that this is disparaging then?

 

A clearly rough looking heavy shuffling slowly along right in front of a crowd of riot cops. He could easily be mistaken for a drunken football thug by the look of him. Most men of his age do not look like that and would have kept away from police with a spring in their step not shuffled lifelessly along.

 

If not you have a rather unusual definition of disparaging...

[mj.scuba]

How he was dressed, how he looked is irrelevant. What is relevant is his behaviour.

 

From the video, you can see the police clearing the street, moving everybody forward. They were all complying with the police orders, apart from one man, who looked to be deliberately on a go slow standing there in order to obstruct the police so they would have to move him, and move him is what one police officer did.

 

That does not mean in anyway he deserved to die, but the police had a job to do, he failed to comply with police instructions, they were right behind him so there is no way he could have not known they wanted the area clear. When the police are not listened to they have to escalate in order to make people comply. What do people expect the police to do when people do not comply? Say "pretty please with a cherry on top will you move"?

[sccsux]

You see fit to wag your fingers at me for being rude etc but it's OK for others who agree with you.

 

Probably 'cause I didn't see the posts as I was typing in conversation with you?

 

Also, if a user did threaten you (which I see - after reading the post concerned - he didn't do) then you can report the post or defend yourself.

 

Mr. Tomlinson, on the other hand, is not here to defend his good name against the slurs of someone who imagines that "MR PRIME I wish a copper would push this guy onto his face, SUB PRIME me thinks." is a threat of violence.

[Mr Prime]

You wouldn't say that this is disparaging then?

 

 

 

If not you have a rather unusual definition of disparaging...

 

No. That is how he appears to the casual onlooker as opposed to someone who knows him. He hardly appears to be a sensitive soul just innocently bypassing trouble. You know that too but dismiss it because you'd rather direct your anger at the copper completely. Balance is everything.

[sccsux]

From the video, you can see the police clearing the street, moving everybody forward. They were all complying with the police orders, apart from one man, who looked to be deliberately on a go slow standing there in order to obstruct the police so they would have to move him, and move him is what one police officer did.

 

Forget the video. The officer himself, under oath, stated that Mr. Tomlinson posed no threat.

 

This officer disobeyed orders to stay in the van, slipped his "handler" and failed to return to the van (giving various reasons to his inability - proven to be lies).

 

Then there's the small fact that the MET denied Mr. Tomlinson had even come into contact with the police at all (read cover up - they even tried to spin it as if they had found him near death and had administered first aid), and only came clean nearly a week later when video evidence was released in The Guardian.

 

This case has opened a whole can of worms for the police.

[sccsux]

No. That is how he appears to the casual onlooker as opposed to someone who knows him.

 

As has already been posted, there are many middle aged men of similar appearance. You failure to see this highlights your bias/prejudice.

 

He hardly appears to be a sensitive soul just innocently bypassing trouble.

 

Yes he does. He just looks like a normal, middle aged bloke with a lot on his mind. As has been pointed out before. There's also the sworn testimony of the office concerned that he posed no threat.

 

You know that too but dismiss it because you'd rather direct your anger at the copper completely.

 

More assumptions I see.

 

Balance is everything.

 

Something you seem to be lacking on this thread.

[Mr Prime]

Probably 'cause I didn't see the posts as I was typing in conversation with you?

 

Also, if a user did threaten you (which I see - after reading the post concerned - he didn't do) then you can report the post or defend yourself.

 

Mr. Tomlinson, on the other hand, is not here to defend his good name against the slurs of someone who imagines that "MR PRIME I wish a copper would push this guy onto his face, SUB PRIME me thinks." is a threat of violence.

 

Tiresome, are you going to answer my points like a man or just keep chucking fluff like this at me? So you don't follow the entire thread now? You just focus on my posts while somehow not seeing everyone else's comments? To say I am slurring him is hysterical, I have used my empathy skills and understanding of human nature to try and see things from the coppers view. I have also agreed that the copper should be disciplined but simply don't believe he directly caused his death. Is that easy enough for you?

 

Despite your po facedness you were one of the few posters I took seriously on here. If you can't explain your double standards then you are no better than INTERVIEWER, Manostrad and other weirdo's and trolls on here.