The inquest on 7/7

[Kaimani]

I think it's easy for anyone to say the emergency services didn't respond quick enough, or didn't do enough, or made mistakes.

 

This was a unique event - nothing like it had happened before. What had happened before was the IRA, who used to plant secondary devices specifically to target the emergency services. On 9/11 the New York fire service sent 400 fire fighters to the scene of the first attack. 343 of those died when the tower they had entered collapsed. Not only did that mean there were 343 more casualties in need of rescue, it also meant there were 343 less rescuers.

 

Whilst it may be true that there are things that could have been done better, there are also a lot of things that could have been done worse. We should be grateful for what the emergency services did that day.

 

I know that the families will feel differently and that is understandable, but from an objective viewpoint, the people to blame for their loved ones deaths were the four men who took bombs onto the trains and bus.

 

true say. the bombers are to blame.

[ratter71]

The coroner in the Derrick Bird case and the entire daily fail readership also seemed to blame the emergency services for deaths due to "elf n safety" laws as the DF readership put it. Whether amateur or professional the teaching is DR ABC.

 

In both 7/7 and Cumbria commenters in certain aspects of the media have been absolute in their view that if you join the emergency services you should expect to take risks and endanger yourself

[Rupert_Baehr]

...In both 7/7 and Cumbria commenters in certain aspects of the media have been absolute in their view that if you join the emergency services you should expect to take risks and endanger yourself

 

But neither those media commentators - people whose major risk is perhaps cirrhosis - nor anybody else has defined the level of risk the emergency services are expected to take.

 

Are they expected to be 'suicide troops'? - Obviously not.

 

Are they expected to take risks? - Yes. Goes with the job.

 

Somebody somewhere made those rules about ensuring it was safe to enter and perhaps the rules need to be reviewed to make them simpler and more clear.

 

That's not quite the same as saying that the present safety standards should be scrapped.

 

The coroner has been quoted as saying that she hopes that her recommendations will be considered and not merely put on the shelf.

 

Does anybody know exactly what those recommendations were? - I don't.

[vResistance]

Despite the five-month inquest many of the victims’ families are calling for a public inquiry into the security services’ operations prior to the terrorist attacks. The mother of Anthony Fatayi-Williams, Marie, said further digging was still needed.

 

But the coroner said she believes that every area had been explored and she hoped this would be the end of the investigation into the bombings.

 

http://www.barnet-today.co.uk/news.cfm?id=17272&searchword=families

 

The Guardian. http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/may/06/7-july-inquest-verdict-no-real-answers

Quotes:

 

"Speaking after the verdicts, however, Graham Foulkes, whose son David was killed in the Edgware Road bombing, said the inquest "causes a lot more questions to be asked than it answers". "It really must compel [the Home Secretary] Theresa May to review the whole operation of the security services in the UK, not just MI5."

 

"He called for an independent inquiry into the killings, with a broader remit than the tightly constrained inquest.

At an emotional press conference after the verdicts were returned, Ros Morley, widow of Edgware Road victim Colin Morley, called for an apology from MI5, saying: "In any other organisation, if huge mistakes were made and lives were lost, people feel there's a duty to look into that, to have a degree of humility, which I feel has been lost."

June Taylor, the mother of Carrie Taylor, who died at Aldgate, was overcome by emotion and collapsed at the press conference after declaring that the family "still have no positive answers".

Grahame Russell, whose son Philip died in the bus bombing at Tavistock Square, said: "There are still issues. The problem I have is that if I continue to hold concerns about issues, then my life would become very bitter." The coroner's recommendations "can help people in the future, one would hope," he said. "But they help me not at all. They do not bring my son back."

 

"Hallett said MI5 must review its procedures on showing photographs to informants after poorly edited images of two of the bombers — "they were dreadful" — were shown by intelligence officers to a key Islamist informant in US custody."

 

The coroner also identified weaknesses involving the Intelligence and Security Committee of MPs and peers, which was shown to have been misled, albeit "inadvertently", by MI5.

She repeatedly emphasised there was no evidence that the attacks could have been prevented. Even the badly cropped photo, in the end, had "played no causative part in the failure to identify Khan or [shehzad] Tanweer".

 

From another source- 'Barnett and whetstone press'. http://www.barnet-today.co.uk/news.cfm?id=17272&searchword=families still want answers

 

"Nader, the husband of Behnaz Mozakka said post-mortems should have been carried out on the victims. He said: “We will never know if they could have been saved.”

 

End quotes:

 

Why I wonder would they not do a proper investigation ?

All it's done has proven there is a need for a genuine puplic enquiry which should've been done in the first place.

 

Is it normal not to do autopsies in such cases ?

How can they know whether lives could have been saved (or not) with better response from the emergency services if they didn't do autopsies ?

[Sheaf-Field]

MI5 had over 5 years to get their story straight, and still failed to satisfy the families. Let alone those who have studied the subject with an open mind and are aware of the clear signs of complicity.

 

It will not be the last word.

[vResistance]

MI5 had over 5 years to get their story straight, and still failed to satisfy the families. Let alone those who have studied the subject with an open mind and are aware of the clear signs of complicity.

 

It will not be the last word.

 

Let's hope not,for the sake of those families so badly let down by the so called investigation/inquest/enquiry/poor attempt at a cover up.

[RootsBooster]

Do we REALLY need another 7/7 thread?

 

Come on mods.... MEGATHREAD TIME!

[vResistance]

Do we REALLY need another 7/7 thread?

 

Come on mods.... MEGATHREAD TIME!

 

It's the only one open and is new information from main media sources about the 7/7 enquiry.

 

Why don't you try and answer some of the questions in the OP instead of trying to have it closed.

 

 

These.-

 

Why I wonder would they not do a proper investigation ?

 

Is it normal not to do autopsies in such cases ?

 

How can they know whether lives could have been saved (or not) with better response from the emergency services if they didn't do autopsies ?

[RootsBooster]

It's the only one open and is new information from main media sources about the 7/7 enquiry.

 

Why don't you try and answer some of the questions in the OP instead of trying to have it closed.

 

 

These.-

 

Why I wonder would they not do a proper investigation ?

 

Is it normal not to do autopsies in such cases ?

 

How can they know whether lives could have been saved (or not) with better response from the emergency services if they didn't do autopsies ?

 

Answer: I don't know, and I doubt that any other SF users are in a position to have such knowledge either. At least this time you're just asking questions and NOT making baseless claims.

 

Yet.

[mj.scuba]

I think it's horrible that the OP has basically found a hobby in peoples grief. Bit like gatecrashing funerals.

 

EDIT: merged thread, does not refer to OP on this thread (Kiamani).