"Slutwalks" in N. America

[quisquose]

It was about 7.00. But come on you don't think women on the school run dress the same as a bunch of girls out on the lash. Not even you can spin that one...

 

I'm saying it was a nice sunny afternoon and there was a lot of cleavage and leg on display. I'm asking you to define 'slutty'.

[Alien]

No I'm afraid I don't.

A sexily dressed man would, in my opinion, have much more chance of being beaten up. I don't know about raped.

And that's the second time you've tried to divert the discussion to include scantily dressed males. To each his own I suppose. There are internet sites you know if you're into all that :D

 

Poor try lad...doesn't work though.

 

Originally Posted by Frank Sidney:

 

But now lets get back to reality, the woman above would be far more likely to be sexually harassed / assaulted than a woman in a trouser suit.]

 

.......................

 

Which implies the more a woman dresses like a man the less likely she is to being assaulted. My reply to that was should male victims in future consider wearing what's regarded as female attire as a means of camouflage? It's just the other side of the coin but pertinent and a male related aspect you brought into the equation, I just embellished on it

3 in 20 males are affected by sexual violence in the UK, 1 in 5 in the US so the numbers and offences are just as important because if you remove gender they are the same...sexual/violent attacks on an innocent. Your suggestion is that the victim is not fully a victim and the perp is not fully a perpetrator because of the dress sense of the victim. As Plek previously mentioned you've provided nothing to substantiate your claim other than suggesting common sense as you see it. The defining factor in assault will be isolation.

[Alien]

So it seems to be all about the possibility of an attack and dressing to avoid one, how can you live your life like that? Avoiding possibilities - you may do it nine times out of ten and then just once you may have your mind on something else

 

Is a mini skirt sluttish, is a crop top sluttish?

 

Which items of clothing are considered sluttish, what if you just happen to get a ladder in your tights? Better to remove them and risk being more sluttish

 

:wow:Careful please...I'm at risk of eating my own words here.

[Frank Sidney]

I'm saying it was a nice sunny afternoon and there was a lot of cleavage and leg on display. I'm asking you to define 'slutty'.

 

Firstly, I never used the word "slutty" its used by the women themselves on the protests.

 

I dunno why we don't win everything at cricket you and Mr x don't half put a decent spin on most things..

[Frank Sidney]

Poor try lad...doesn't work though.

 

Originally Posted by Frank Sidney:

 

But now lets get back to reality, the woman above would be far more likely to be sexually harassed / assaulted than a woman in a trouser suit.]

 

.......................

 

Which implies the more a woman dresses like a man the less likely she is to being assaulted. My reply to that was should male victims in future consider wearing what's regarded as female attire as a means of camouflage? It's just the other side of the coin but pertinent and a male related aspect you brought into the equation, I just embellished on it

3 in 20 males are affected by sexual violence in the UK, 1 in 5 in the US so the numbers and offences are just as important because if you remove gender they are the same...sexual/violent attacks on an innocent. Your suggestion is that the victim is not fully a victim and the perp is not fully a perpetrator because of the dress sense of the victim. As Plek previously mentioned you've provided nothing to substantiate your claim other than suggesting common sense as you see it. The defining factor in assault will be isolation.

 

Well, I'm afraid that's what I believe. A woman dressed in a trouser suit is less likely to get the attention we have been talking about. But they have to be in the same location and under the same circumstances. Of course a woman in a trouser suit on the lash up town surrounded by drunken men is more likely to be assaulted than a half dressed woman sat at a desk. That's were the data fails.

 

In relation to the male rape issue. As I have said before it depends on the survey. What situation and where were the men when they were assaulted? I would bet that a large number were in prison, or some other institution or establishment. Or to open another debate many were probably assaulted in younger years by a trusted family member or even a Catholic Priest, or the like.

 

Pleks argument is flawed, and yours, to be honest. I, and the police officer, never said, that ALL women assaulted are dressed in a certain way. Of course, others will be. Its to do with location and opportunity as well. However, the officer was advising women that there is more possibility, in certain circumstances, that they will receive unwanted attention if they dress in a certain way and he was trying to reduce this risk.

 

I dunno if any of the female supporters of your claim will carry out some proper survey by walking through town on a Saturday night dressed in the two outfits discussed to see what a different reaction they get?

[quisquose]

Just to emphasise the point.

 

Here are two clips of girls. Which one do you think would receive (albeit unwanted) attention from men?

 

1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZbB1PdajLU&feature=related

 

2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PT6Po4XqP5E

 

Anyway I think the officer was stating that the girl in 2 is less likely to attract unwanted attention from predatory males. He advised the girls for their own safety that this type of clothing would not attract the same attention as the girl in 1.

 

Try to ignore all the moral and legal arguments in that women should be able to wear what they like. Of course they should. The cold truth is that women who wear provocative clothes are more likely to be harassed by some men..

 

I didn't click on your links yesterday, but in an effort to better understand your position I just have.

 

Now this is odd, because the girl in 2, with her heavy makeup, low cut top and short skirt, is probably wearing the sort of clothing that the police officer was warning about.

 

The two women in 1, striding confidently down the high street in their bikinis, are probably deliberately seeking attention, and they probably got it in equal measure from men and women alike. However, their confident manner suggests to me that they are unlikely to receive the sort of attention that they don't want.

 

I think it just shows how muddled your thinking actually is.

[Cyclone]

Firstly, I never used the word "slutty" its used by the women themselves on the protests.

 

 

You are defending the comments of a police officer who thinks it's okay to describe women as "dressing up like sluts" though...

[Frank Sidney]

I didn't click on your links yesterday, but in an effort to better understand your position I just have.

 

Now this is odd, because the girl in 2, with her heavy makeup, low cut top and short skirt, is probably wearing the sort of clothing that the police officer was warning about.

 

The two women in 1, striding confidently down the high street in their bikinis, are probably deliberately seeking attention, and they probably got it in equal measure from men and women alike. However, their confident manner suggests to me that they are unlikely to receive the sort of attention that they don't want.

 

I think it just shows how muddled your thinking actually is.

 

I feel you are grasping at straws now. You haven't answered any of the points I raised in my last post. Like if the two girls were in the same situation say a night club, which one would receive the most lurid attention? You need to think out of the box, you're very rigid in your opinions.

 

I think it shows how puddled your thinking actually is.

[Frank Sidney]

You are defending the comments of a police officer who thinks it's okay to describe women as "dressing up like sluts" though...

 

Why is it a problem? The women seem to think its okay to use the term?

[Cyclone]

Okay, that should end the topic, you don't understand why it's a problem to tell women not to dress like sluts, you can't see how that might have negative connotations or offend anyone, why it might be seen as implying that any subsequent harassment was their fault.

Are you single? I assume so, but if not, when your other half asks if she looks nice in the future, tell her she's dressed like a slut. You'll be single soon afterwards, but might then understand why it's a problem.