danot Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 How can you be responsible, and preventative when there is no set criteria to rape or attack? A woman may think, I'm not dressing like that to avoid being attacked and still be a victim.Of course she could, but the woman who's covered up wouldn't have every bloke in the club thinking the same things about what they'd like to do to her would she. She wouldn't be intentionally dressing in a style that encapsulates the image of the commercially sexualised woman, the image that is widely condemned and criticised by people like your good self- Cause and affect!! (oh the irony) Posted by rontherekred Repeating "she must take responsibility" doesn't cure or reduce rape unless she uses your definition and includes all scenarios, which is vast. But I haven't used all scenarios, I've used the examples you asked for... remember? Posted by ronthenekred Men are also attacked, do I consider every scenario before stepping out the door? If I did I would empower the attacker. No, not every scenario, but you would need to consider the outcome of your actions if you were to drunkenly gyrate yourself around the fella's in a gay bar dressed like Bruno shaking your booty like beyonce. Cause and affect. Posted by ronthenekred Using dumb analogies such as "would you go to a rangers match wearing a Celtic shirt" only works if you ask a woman "would you go to a venue on your own if all were known rapists". No she wouldn't. That's the point, they don't come in fluorescent Green, they can be you, me or the local vicar. I totally agree with you here because she'd have taken the necessary precautions to avoid an attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Sleeps Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 the female can certainly dress in a way that will maybe lessen the likelihood of this by not attracting the attention in the first place. Women are allowed to draw attention to themselves. I met my girlfriend when I saw her and was attracted to her. I behaved with responsibility though and talked to her, rather than grabbing her and calling her a slut. The joys of being an adult, I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riche Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 Why would you want to dress like a pro? If you didn't want recieve the attensions of men with no self control. Or is it that they want to draw attension to their bare flesh on their terms. Ie you look buff what with your tatas and muscles now get me a Macky D and you can bab me up. Sheffield is full of male and female slags. Not pretty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC Spyda Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 Women are allowed to draw attention to themselves. I met my girlfriend when I saw her and was attracted to her. I behaved with responsibility though and talked to her, rather than grabbing her and calling her a slut. The joys of being an adult, I suppose. Once again. No one is saying that they are not allowed. I think you are arguing a point that hasn't been made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danot Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 No it isn't. Not one bit. I used the transvestite hypothesis on the deleted thread. If someone wishes to wear clothes that draws attention then so be it, but it isn't irresponsible. They aren't doing anything wrong at all.OK. Just for the purpose of illustrating my point- answer me this- Would it be irresponsible to walk down the street counting a bundle of twenty pound notes knowing that some scum ball is likely to attack you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 We are talking about many things within this thread stemming from the main issue. I have seen with my own eyes women in clubs getting sexually assaulted because of the skimpy outfits they are wearing. How could you tell it was because of their clothing? Are you confusing correlation with causation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronthenekred Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 I did it because she looked rather nice, turned me on and I am a , so therefore used power to get what I want. Which one is relevant and which one is subjective? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Sleeps Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 OK. Just for the purpose of illustrating my point- answer me this- Would it be irresponsible to walk down the street counting a bundle of twenty pound notes knowing that some scum ball is likely to attack you? Is this 'Odd Hypothesis Saturday'? I walked past a hungry man with a hat made of bread too. I was terribly suprised when he ate it. Would it be irresponsible to walk down the street wearing an expensive watch? No. People do it all the time. Even though we know muggers do exist, we understand that we are not morally responsible for being the victims of crime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC Spyda Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 How could you tell it was because of their clothing? Are you confusing correlation with causation? Because many of the guys have told me that was the reason. Of course I don't mean the skimpy clothing literally caused them to get sexually assaulted. If they were wearing something less skimpy, it would not have happened. I know plenty of clubs that I could take you to so that you could also see it with your own eyes. you will see the girls with skimpy clothing getting touched and groped without permission and the more covered up girls left alone. In fact I invite you to join me at one of these clubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 It is if you know you're going to attract unwanted attention. Given that most women who go out dressed up don't get attacked, you can't seriously be implying that the few unfortunate ones who are could somehow have known that it was going to happen? It doesn't matter what other people should do. It's what they do do that concerns me. Idealisms and moral codes count for nothing out there Chris. It's naive and completely irresponsible to wear something provocative knowing it's going to attract undesirable attention. It's misogynistic and counter productive to shift the responsibility and thus blame onto potential victims by telling them to change their behaviour to avoid being attacked. Ideally, everyone should be able to wear whatever they want without being attacked or molested but they can't. That's how it is, don't shoot the messenger. It would be irresponsible to prance around in the sheff united cop wearing a sheff wed top though wouldn't it?- Cause and affect Chris. Chris. It doesn't matter who is to blame. I'm not talking about blame, I'm talking about taking steps to prevent the attack. If someone ignores your 'advice' the victim is now open to "I told you so", which is in affect them being blamed for ignoring the advice. Your advice leads directly to blaming the victim. Anybody would think that we're meant to live in perfect harmony. I'd rather think that we are meant to, whilst knowing we don't, than blame women for being raped. That's just an idealistic dream that's never going to happen. It's in our nature to do terrible things to one another and unless people realise this and take the necessary precautions they're going to be sitting ducks. So what does this mean for women? They should wear a burkha to avoid attack? Would that even work, we've not seen any evidence yet that skimpy clothing increases the risk of sexual attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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