boyfriday Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Crap. There are several lasses in my school that, with a bit of make up and the right clothes, could easily pass for far older. One 11 year old could easily pass for 18 if the above conditions were met. I thought she was 14 or 15 when I first saw her and that was while she was wearing school uniform. Even ignoring the possibility the girl in question looked older, it's still not as bad as a girl being forced by violence. I'm not arguing it's right for a man to have sex with a young lass, it's clearly not, but I am arguing it's worse to beat a lass up and rape her. Thus - there are degrees of rape. Forgive me, but I'm not debating the physical appearance of an 11 year old who could pass as an 18 year old. The fact remains she is not emotionally mature enough to have the capacity to consent to sexual intercourse with an adult. ..and no, there aren't 'degrees of rape'. Whether you believe the phrase overeggs the pudding or not, 'rape' is quite simply having penetrative sex with someone without their consent-assuming they have the faculty to consent, which children don't. The actions that created the offence are taken account of during the sentencing exercise as I said previously. It seems some people are reluctant to accept this I guess because the term is a fairly sensational one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upinwath Posted May 20, 2011 Author Share Posted May 20, 2011 I think the language you use tells it's own story Only if you're willing to accept a lie as the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upinwath Posted May 20, 2011 Author Share Posted May 20, 2011 Forgive me, but I'm not debating the physical appearance of an 11 year old who could pass as an 18 year old. The fact remains she is not emotionally mature enough to have the capacity to consent to sexual intercourse with an adult. ..and no, there aren't 'degrees of rape'. . But if she looked older, the man may not be aware he was engaged in a crime. Lets face it, you don't ask for a passport when you're in with a chance of a shag. That makes appearance a possible factor in a non violent rape. Of course it's still wrong but less of a crime than a violent rape of the same lass. ..and no, there aren't 'degrees of rape'. . Looking at the poll, you're in the minority by a long way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent Orange Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Only if you're willing to accept a lie as the truth. The truth hurts, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upinwath Posted May 20, 2011 Author Share Posted May 20, 2011 The truth hurts, I guess. Hurts the one who likes to lie would be closer to the truth but you may have some problems in knowing the truth if it came up and smashed you in the face with a brick. You're Tony Blair and I claim my five quid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent Orange Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Hurts the one who likes to lie would be closer to the truth but you may have some problems in knowing the truth if it came up and smashed you in the face with a brick. You're Tony Blair and I claim my five quid. No lies. It's all there in your posts. Although, you would deny it, wouldn't you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 But if she looked older, the man may not be aware he was engaged in a crime. Lets face it, you don't ask for a passport when you're in with a chance of a shag. That makes appearance a possible factor in a non violent rape. Of course it's still wrong but less of a crime than a violent rape of the same lass. Well I guess it's incumbent on men to be less cavalier in how they select their sexual partners, that's certainly the advice I give/gave my sons. Looking at the poll, you're in the minority by a long way. Well I'm not actually, since I don't believe anyone thinks that men should be able to have sex with girls/women without their consent and not be described as a rapist. As Ive said all along it's the other features of the offence that make it 'better' or 'worse' than another. So in your example of a man 'inadvertently' having sex with an underage girl because he believed she was older-well that's not a defence, otherwise men would be able to have sex with under age girls and use that excuse to avoid prosecution-(imagine the 11 year old in your earlier example being routinely abused because she looked 18 and appeared to be consenting). However his sentence would be lighter than the man who abducts a child off the street, beats her up and rapes her. Both girl's have been raped but the in the second example the other factors mean the sentence would be higher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llamatron Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Well I guess it's incumbent on men to be less cavalier in how they select their sexual partners, that's certainly the advice I give/gave my sons. Well I'm not actually, since I don't believe anyone thinks that men should be able to have sex with girls/women without their consent and not be described as a rapist. As Ive said all along it's the other features of the offence that make it 'better' or 'worse' than another. So in your example of a man 'inadvertently' having sex with an underage girl because he believed she was older-well that's not a defence, otherwise men would be able to have sex with under age girls and use that excuse to avoid prosecution-(imagine the 11 year old in your earlier example being routinely abused because she looked 18 and appeared to be consenting). However his sentence would be lighter than the man who abducts a child off the street, beats her up and rapes her. Both girl's have been raped but the in the second example the other factors mean the sentence would be higher. You are agreeing with everyone else but being pedantic about the wording aren't you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kthebean Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Why would you ask that? I dislike extremists of all types including extremist feminists. That doesn't translate to a hatred of women unless you're too thick to think of a real argument. What makes them 'extremist'? Do they burn down strip clubs and bomb places they believe are symbols of the patriarchy? Or do they just have views that are extremely different from yours? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upinwath Posted May 20, 2011 Author Share Posted May 20, 2011 Well I guess it's incumbent on men to be less cavalier in how they select their sexual partners, that's certainly the advice I give/gave my sons. I would have to agree, boys should take more care but this is the real world and boys are told they can shag without consequences and it's always someone else at fault if they do something wrong. I can't help it if UK society has taken a rough turn. So in your example of a man 'inadvertently' having sex with an underage girl because he believed she was older-well that's not a defence, otherwise men would be able to have sex with under age girls and use that excuse to avoid prosecution-( I'm pretty sure it has been used but it's no excuse. My only point is I can see how a man could have sex with a young lass and not even realise it. I've not claimed it was right or proper. I do claim it's a product of stupid liberal ideas about free sex. Children see it all over the place and think it's OK for them as well. It's going to happen if society accepts semi naked lasses in newspapers that are delivered by 12 year old boys. What the hell does anyone expect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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