Panorama Undercover Care: The abuse exposed

[Gram?]

Lets wait for the criminal investigation to be completed before we start flinging mud eh?

[Arguendo]

Absolutely disgusting, all the individuals who work at this home need either arresting and/or banning from working with vulnerable adults ever again. As other SF members have posted this problem is endemic throughout the private healthcare area which deals with elderly or challenging behaviour adults. I can clearly relate to the whistleblower & his challenges in attempting to address the poor & illegal care given to the clients.

 

What’s even more upsetting is the other nurses although not identified as being part of the abuse are just as guiltier; they have a professional duty of care according to the NMC code of conduct. They must have been aware; they should have intervened, as they are the protectors and voices of their clients, I have always been aware that care in the homes lack the quality in which the clients deserve but this way beyond my expectations.

[Alien]

zzz, let's face it, it is, unless you suggest Tracy and Karen look after them on the minimum wage? I'm sure they'll be well motivated. Millie Tant's final paragraph will cost a fortune for a start.

 

Go play elsewhere troll.

[Arguendo]

In respect to the home featured I don’t think they can be classed as being on minimum wage, according to the investigator the carers were on £16.500pa, this is very good in respect to most challenging behaviour units, although normal residential rates are lower for healthcare assistants, around 6.50 -7.50 per hour. Many staff will work continental shifts; hours being 07:00 -19:30, they’ll do 3 days per week & pick up additional shifts throughout the week. Personally I don’t feel the pay has to do anything with it, it is the staffs attitude & lack of compassion or ability to care.

 

I also believe profit before quality is an issue, £3.500 per week for challenging behaviour compared to £600 pw for residential care, increased according to the level of nursing care needed. And as I said in my previous post, where, are the qualified nurses & management, I myself would not have hesitated in getting head office support, suspending & initiating safeguarding procedures, but none of this was done, shame on them.

 

As I’ve also stated the problem is widespread, unfortunately health care assistants are not placed on any register & go from home to home, unless they are convicted, which many home avoid like the plague. However qualified nurses are registered & have to answer to their professional body, take a look at this link to the NMC hearings

 

http://www.nmc-uk.org/Hearings/Hearings-and-outcomes/

 

look at the names, offences & most notably the punishment/decisions made, this is only a small representation of what really goes on in elderly/vulnerable adult private health care.

[Bassman62]

I know running private homes like Winterbourne are expensive, but £3,500 per week per patient....

I hope more money is invested in the bodies that regulate & inspect care homes for the vulnerable & elderley. Perhaps if staff knew that spot checks were regular then this kind of abuse might be less common. Also regular training & certification for staff may help

It would be intersting to find how many of these companys and private care/nursing homes were set up after Thatcherism pursued any avenue where profit could be made.

What qualifications do these carers have, could you have walked into a carers job in a council run care/nursing home without training or qualifications?

Regarding £3500 per patient per week thats 89 times per week what my wife would have received from the government had she agreed to look after and care for her mother.

[Bassman62]

although normal residential rates are lower for healthcare assistants, around 6.50 -7.50 per hour. Many staff will work continental shifts; hours being 07:00 -19:30, they’ll do 3 days per week

Well on £16500 p.a. or £8.80 per hour for three 12 hour shifts they should be attracting a higher and better qualified workforce.

[*_ash_*]

Personally I don’t feel the pay has to do anything with it, it is the staffs attitude & lack of compassion or ability to care.

 

Well on £16500 p.a. or £8.80 per hour for three 12 hour shifts they should be attracting a higher and better qualified workforce.

 

Sorry bassman, looks like I'm having a go at you again in my 'spaced out dream world', but I'm not, it's coincidence that we're online at the same times...

 

You seem to be missing Argu's point. The bit that I have left of his/her post is absolutely spot on.

 

Thatcherism or any of the rest of your other post has nothing to do with it.

 

Let me put it another way, and ask you a question... though I doubt you'll answer me.

 

If you worked in that home and I ran it, and I offered you minimum wage, or £20 an hour, how would this affect how you treated these vulnerable people?

 

If I paid you £50/hour, would you treat them with more respect? And if I paid you min wage, would you abuse them, or treat them badly?

 

-

 

I know what your answer will be... of course, I know that you wouldn't abuse them, that's not my point. You are just thinking in different terms to me. You think that paying higher money gets better things. That's why you don't get the quote by argu that I linked to your post.

 

You said it yourself, these staff are on £16,000. Hardly peanuts. If I paid them double, do you think they would change their behaviour?

[Bassman62]

Sorry bassman, looks like I'm having a go at you again in my 'spaced out dream world', but I'm not, it's coincidence that we're online at the same times...

 

You seem to be missing Argu's point. The bit that I have left of his/her post is absolutely spot on.

 

Thatcherism or any of the rest of your other post has nothing to do with it.

 

Let me put it another way, and ask you a question... though I doubt you'll answer me.

 

If you worked in that home and I ran it, and I offered you minimum wage, or £20 an hour, how would this affect how you treated these vulnerable people?

 

If I paid you £50/hour, would you treat them with more respect? And if I paid you min wage, would you abuse them, or treat them badly?

 

-

 

I know what your answer will be... of course, I know that you wouldn't abuse them, that's not my point. You are just thinking in different terms to me. You think that paying higher money gets better things. That's why you don't get the quote by argu that I linked to your post.

 

You said it yourself, these staff are on £16,000. Hardly peanuts. If I paid them double, do you think they would change their behaviour?

I was answering someone who said many homes paid £6.50-£7.50 per hour, do you expect to get people with actual qualifications to work for that kind of money?

Regarding the home in question all the staff from top to bottom should under investigation not just 4, it is quite obvious that the care home in question is purely a money making machine and that senior members of staff (if there are any) took part in or ignored the abuse, visitors were kept in a small sector and not allowed into the main part of the building which alone should have rung allarm bells.

[*_ash_*]

I was answering someone who said many homes paid £6.50-£7.50 per hour, do you expect to get people with actual qualifications to work for that kind of money?

Qualifications don't necessarily create reasonable human beings.

 

 

Also. Do you know any of the qualifications of any of the staff?... because I watched it and never saw any information about qualifications of most of the staff. All was said was 'anyone can apply for support work'. It never said any of them had/hadn't got qualifications. You are getting ahead of yourself again.

I was answering someone who said many homes paid £6.50-£7.50 per hour, do you expect to get people with actual qualifications to work for that kind of money?

Not only would I expect people who are working for 6.50/7.50 to treat other human beings with repsect, I would expect people who volunteer/ and work for absolutely nothing to treat people (especially vulnerable people) with respect.

 

You seem to have a monetary value on human to human care.

 

I don't care whether the staff in there were on minimum wage; no-wage; or £130,000/week, there is absolutely NO excuse for that behaviour towards people who are incapable of looking after themselves, regardless to how much they were/are paid.

[andikay]

Qualifications don't necessarily create reasonable human beings.

 

 

Also. Do you know any of the qualifications of any of the staff?... because I watched it and never saw any information about qualifications of most of the staff. All was said was 'anyone can apply for support work'. It never said any of them had/hadn't got qualifications. You are getting ahead of yourself again.

 

Not only would I expect people who are working for 6.50/7.50 to treat other human beings with repsect, I would expect people who volunteer/ and work for absolutely nothing to treat people (especially vulnerable people) with respect.

 

You seem to have a monetary value on human to human care.

 

I don't care whether the staff in there were on minimum wage; no-wage; or £130,000/week, there is absolutely NO excuse for that behaviour towards people who are incapable of looking after themselves, regardless to how much they were/are paid.

 

Very good points carers usually care because that’s what they love to do, some obviously do it because it’s the only work they can get, all a wage increase will do is encourage even more people to become carers for the money instead of the love of caring. It’s not going to be an easy one to solve but I don’t think a wage increase is the answer.