ConDem controlled Birmingham City Council outsources jobs to India

[andikay]

Does it really matter whether the jobs, if based in the UK were employing EU or UK workers? The fact remains that they pay TAX in the UK, they buy their food etc in the UK thereby returning some of the cost of the call centre to the UK economy. How exactly does the UK economy benefit by tranfering the jobs to India?

Especially considering that English is, primarily, a second language. Those with the best English are head-hunted to the more profitable call centres, leaving only those with poor English skills. As their English improves they jump ship to better paying call centres and are replaced with further poor English speakers. And don't think that Birmingham Council is going to be using the most expensive call centres!

 

The cost of providing extra services, infrastructure and accommodation to accommodate someone coming here to work is greater than the financial contribution they would make to the economy. If the job can’t be done in the home country (eg Doctor) then there are benefits to them coming here. If the job (eg call centre) can be done in their home county then we benefit without having to provide them with services (eg Schooling for their children). They benefit because they can now spend money in their country and don’t have to leave family and friend.

[andikay]

British people come first before any consideration of saving money/profit. If that's not the case, the UK is doomed.

 

I agree British people should come first but unfortunately that isn't the case now and wasn’t the case before the election. British workers have to compete with foreign workers and it make more sense to employ some foreign workers in their country and not this country.

 

Hundreds of workers at a Fife power station have staged an unofficial walk-out in support of workers in England protesting over use of foreign labour.

 

The contract workers based at Longannet Power Station walked off shift after a meeting on Thursday.

 

They are supporting contract workers in England who say that other companies are using Spanish and Italian staff ahead of UK-based staff.

[Iuchi_Zien]

The cost of providing extra services, infrastructure and accommodation to accommodate someone coming here to work is greater than the financial contribution they would make to the economy. If the job can’t be done in the home country (eg Doctor) then there are benefits to them coming here. If the job (eg call centre) can be done in their home county then we benefit without having to provide them with services (eg Schooling for their children). They benefit because they can now spend money in their country and don’t have to leave family and friend.

 

Don't agree. They are paying taxes for services they will never use. If they are migrants intending to return home they are paying into a pension pot they will not be able to take advantage of. If they are staying then we have a worker in the UK we have not had to educate, so we have saved the cost of educating that worker. Also if work becomes unavailable the majority of 'EU' workers return home or move to a country doing better than the UK. Why do you think we had a jobless free recession? We HAVE lost thousands of jobs, but we also lost thousands of EU workers at the same time. Do you honestly believe that EU workers, or any other kind of worker costs more than the tax income they generate? If you do where are the statistics supporting your case?

[andikay]

Don't agree. They are paying taxes for services they will never use. If they are migrants intending to return home they are paying into a pension pot they will not be able to take advantage of. If they are staying then we have a worker in the UK we have not had to educate, so we have saved the cost of educating that worker. Also if work becomes unavailable the majority of 'EU' workers return home or move to a country doing better than the UK. Why do you think we had a jobless free recession? We HAVE lost thousands of jobs, but we also lost thousands of EU workers at the same time. Do you honestly believe that EU workers, or any other kind of worker costs more than the tax income they generate? If you do where are the statistics supporting your case?

 

The fact that some will be working for a low wages gives them the right to claim working tax credits and child tax credits even if their children don't come to the UK with them. If they do the job in their country they would not qualify and would not need accommodation, something that many young British people cannot afford.

We still gain a skilled educated worker if they stay where they are and work for a British organization we just don’t have to provide them with health care, education for their children, accommodation, tax and child tax credits, roads and public transport and they benefit by living in their home country. Obviously this couldn’t apply to a seasonal fruit picker or a doctor but can apply to a call centre employee.

[Iuchi_Zien]

The fact that some will be working for a low wages gives them the right to claim working tax credits and child tax credits even if their children don't come to the UK with them. If they do the job in their country they would not qualify and would not need accommodation, something that many young British people cannot afford.

We still gain a skilled educated worker if they stay where they are and work for a British organization we just don’t have to provide them with health care, education for their children, accommodation, tax and child tax credits, roads and public transport and they benefit by living in their home country. Obviously this couldn’t apply to a seasonal fruit picker or a doctor but can apply to a call centre employee.

 

So anybody on low wages is a net burden to the UK economy? Or is it just EU workers on a low wage who are a burden to the economy?

Based upon your model let's say we use a call centre in Poland with English speaking staff, who will have to be paid extra as the staff require a second language of fair to good quality so we pay them £10,000 per year, we have 50 staff so that is £500,000 per year being removed from our economy to the Polish economy How is that more beneficial than employing those 50 staff in the UK where our own tax system receives the taxes and the money, some or all, is spent in UK shops?

[Iuchi_Zien]

The fact that some will be working for a low wages gives them the right to claim working tax credits and child tax credits even if their children don't come to the UK with them. If they do the job in their country they would not qualify and would not need accommodation, something that many young British people cannot afford.

We still gain a skilled educated worker if they stay where they are and work for a British organization we just don’t have to provide them with health care, education for their children, accommodation, tax and child tax credits, roads and public transport and they benefit by living in their home country. Obviously this couldn’t apply to a seasonal fruit picker or a doctor but can apply to a call centre employee.

My bold

 

You mean we have to build new roads and add new public transport to service these EU workers!! And even if we did isn't this an opportunity to employ MORE people, isn't increasing the number of jobs in the UK one of the goals of this government?

[Iuchi_Zien]

You might also want to bear in mind what is a basic skill in the UK, the ability to speak English is classed as a skilled worker in almost every other EU country. So don't think the workers will be paid less if they work in Romania/Poland/Latvia et al.

[evildrneil]

Wouldn't want to libel anyone Tone, but does it not strike you that there may be a conflict of interest? Like the comment at the bottom of the article says:

 

 

"The council’s deputy leader, Lib Dem Paul Tilsley who is a board member of Service Birmingham, the council’s joint venture with Capita"

This is a conflict of interest, he is being payed by the people of Birmingham to look after their interest and is being payed as a board member of Service to increase their profits.

Capita is the UK's leading outsourcing company,where is their commitment to Birmingham jobs ?.

This story stinks, greed over everything and everybody.

 

It appears that Service Birmingham is a joint venture between the council and Capita specifically set up to look after the ICT services to Birmingham council as such surely it's perfectly reasonable to have at least one council member on the board to represent the needs of the council in the operations of the organisation?

[ricgem2002]

Don't agree. They are paying taxes for services they will never use. If they are migrants intending to return home they are paying into a pension pot they will not be able to take advantage of.

so are you upset that they might have paid into a system they couldnt have taken advantage off ?

[andikay]

So anybody on low wages is a net burden to the UK economy? Or is it just EU workers on a low wage who are a burden to the economy?

Based upon your model let's say we use a call centre in Poland with English speaking staff, who will have to be paid extra as the staff require a second language of fair to good quality so we pay them £10,000 per year, we have 50 staff so that is £500,000 per year being removed from our economy to the Polish economy How is that more beneficial than employing those 50 staff in the UK where our own tax system receives the taxes and the money, some or all, is spent in UK shops?

 

EU workers on a low wage answering the phone in the UK instead of answering the phone in Poland would be a greater burden. Both do the job we want them to do but the one that comes here is a greater burden on public services. The polish worker that as a family to support also sends most of the disposable income home so it would be better for both them and us if they do the job in their country.

The British worker already lives here so is already a burden if they don't contribute.