Harleyman Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Well I can imagine your wife and daughter might feel uncomfortable accompanying you there. Would you be happy if your wife took you to a bar where those serving drinks were exclusively young hunky men in speedos? Would you be happy for her to be going regularly alone or with her friends? Actually if my wife were to tell me one day that she wanted an evening out with the girls at Chippendales I wouldn't bat an eyelid. She knows that when I was working in the Pasadena area I used to eat at Hooters occasionaly with the lads for lunch which didn't bother her either . It's a question of mutual trust . Neither of us has the slightest intention of getting laid by the help. It's just harmless fun you see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyman Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Because its not an issue of equality, its an issue of some women with a chip on their shoulder with men.... That's another point though, what about gay men visiting a female lap dancing club for a bit of fun. Would that be okay, Ruby, Suffy?...It wouldn't be about sex.. I'm sure there must be gay strip clubs for men in Hollywood and San Franciso Would Ruby or Suffragette find anything wrong with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattricia Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 I reckon at the next "Meet" we should go to Spearmint Rhinos. For research purposes, of course... Ive offered many a time to go as an undercover reporter for SF to La Chambre, in Attercliffe, but they always close the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plekhanov Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 I see what you're saying, however, my argument, Plek, is the normalisation, mainstreaming and claims of 'harmless fun' of these types of pseudo-sex venues where breasts (and arse in the case of Playboy) are clearly how they are marketed along with the image of the sexed up servile woman, whether that be Hooters or Playboy. They validate the notion of women are playthings, adornments and whose raison d'etre is to be in servitude to men and this has a knock on effect on wider society. I personally do not buy the 'no one is forcing them to do it' or 'it's their choice' arguments to justify their existence, regardless of whether or not it is a choice. I'm not undermining sex work as a valid choice at all, just highlighting how superficially it may not be what it seems. I base this on having spoken to numerous sex workers over the years, through various lines of work and research, however, I appreciate that they will not speak for all women working in the industry. This whole "knock on effect on wider society" seems very weak to me & every bit of research I've ever seen upon the subject has been abjectly ideologically driven. Women are more equal & more powerful in our society now that at any time in history and gender equality has improved over the last century as society has become more permissive. And it's pretty clear that that isn't a mere correlation, there's a clear causative link between free expression in all its form & the emancipation of women. Can you show me a society contemporary or historical with high levels of "public morality" in which women are anything like as equal as they are in the west today with all our "images of the sexed up servile woman". I don't like Playboy but like the demands for censorship and other coercive legislation from the likes of Object far less. I'm not sure that I agree with the abortion analogy, for a variety of reasons which haven't time to enumerate (school run beckons). However, I am in totally agreement with you about the inherent contradictions in some schools of feminist thinking. I'll never ever be part of the anti-prostitution/porn brigade and those who were/are anti-the pill and abortion I will never understand and have argued with them till I am blue in the face. If you weren't attempting to undermine the validity "sex work as a valid choice" in the way anti-choicers seek to undermine the choice to abort then I think you worded you post very poorly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Ive offered many a time to go as an undercover reporter for SF to La Chambre, in Attercliffe, but they always close the thread. I think you, me and Suffy did ponder it once upon a time pattricia, but it was a triumvirate that would have been overwhelmed by racial and sexual stereotypes (I'll split the film rights with you) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattricia Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 I think you, me and Suffy did ponder it once upon a time pattricia, but it was a triumvirate that would have been overwhelmed by racial and sexual stereotypes (I'll split the film rights with you) You have an excellent memory boyfriday, but pray tell me what "triumvirate" means will you ? Is it some kind of sex manual ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 You have an excellent memory boyfriday, but pray tell me what "triumvirate" means will you ? Is it some kind of sex manual ? :hihi: ..it can be whatever you want it to be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mj.scuba Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 So what's the thought on Chantelle Houghton using her body to promote good causes? Ban wild animals in circuses, very worthy cause some might say. Promoting veganism also admirable some might think. She's using her body and looks for both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJC1 Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Freedom is the way forward for a progressive society, and that means the freedom for people to do things that you might not approve of or choose to do yourself. So we're switching to 'freedom' now, is this the same freedom which prevents women from walking the streets without being sexually harassed? I ask myself what causes this, is it bad men? or perhaps this kind of unacceptable behaviour is facilitated and normalised through the kind of communication that says it is OK to leer and letch / grope women, like in a strip bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plekhanov Posted June 9, 2011 Share Posted June 9, 2011 So we're switching to 'freedom' now, is this the same freedom which prevents women from walking the streets without being sexually harassed? I ask myself what causes this, is it bad men? or perhaps this kind of unacceptable behaviour is facilitated and normalised through the kind of communication that says it is OK to leer and letch / grope women, like in a strip bar. And your proof that strip clubs cause women to be sexually harassed in the streets is what? As I understand it Egypt is one of the worst societies in the world as regard the sexual harassment of women as they attempt to go about their business. Yet Egypt is also a significantly less socially liberal society than ours. If as you claim "strip bars" are the cause of sexual harassment how can this be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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