boyfriday Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 But may come to the same conclusion. Indeed, so let's put it another way. If Anjem Choudary was deriding Jews and Christians (as he often does), his view wouldn't be considered in the same way as say Yasmin Alibhai-Brown, a moderate Muslim's view would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CXC3000 Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 That is not what's happened here at all though. Bassman put forward a verse which contained the phrase: "And those you fear may be rebellious admonish; banish them to their couches, and beat them." CXC responded by strongly implying that it was a metaphor and that Bassman just didn't understand it. That is correct. Please tell me, in what context does that passage not mean 'beat your wife if she doesn't obey you'. Because that is exactly what it says, and it fits perfectly in context with the surrounding verses. Tell me, what have I missed? As I said, the incorrect word 'beat' should not be used. The most acceptable translation is to 'leave' or 'go away' from them. Nothing too difficult about that (especially taking the Hadiths into account re. how one should be kind and hospitable towards one's wife) Nonsense and unbelievable you say? So is it nonsense that we have had to massively adjust our airport screening procedures? That we have had to expand our counter-terrorism activities? That we have apprehended numerous extremists Muslims planning atriocities against their adopted countrymen? Is it unbelievable nonsense that Muslims extremists killed people in New York and on London trains and buses? Or that they have planned to do similar things again? Or that Muslim clerics have been convicted of inciting hatred? Vent your anger at the extremists, not the average Muslim (which is 99.9% of them). You were claiming it was just a metaphor that Bassman didn't understand. Yep. Shall I take the fact that you have now completely changed arguments as a concession that you were lying? Nope; I stand by what I said. Also, I might point out that Bassman put forward several different translations of that verse It doesn't mean they're right. Once again you are lying. No. There are plenty of Muslim scholars out there who would disagree with you, it is most certainly not just anti-Muslims that translate it that way. There will be many who will have the opposite view. Quran.com translates it as 'strike them' Quranexplorer.com gives it as 'scourge them' Quranflash.com Translates it as 'beat her' Those are the top 3 results in google if you search for 'quran online', none of them is anti muslim, they are all pro Islam. Just because they're the top 3 results, doesn't mean they're correct. Many racist and anti-Muslim websites are top of the pile; are we to assume they're 'correct' too ? I'm not so interested in that. I'm interested in exposing you as someone who cannot be trusted and is willing to lie to try and win an argument. If you hadn't lied and pretended it was all metaphor I wouldn't even have posted on this thread. Sadly, the only lies are from what you (and Bassman) posted. In any case those are from the hadiths, everytime I find something distasteful in one of the hadiths any Muslims that I present it to just say that the hadiths don't really count. Trying to have their cake and eat it. The Hadiths must also be used in context (just like the Quranic verses). Yes, there'll be many fabricated and unauthentic Hadiths, but we must try to weed them out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecky Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 More than you'd like to think. Give examples then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 OK don't go OTT BF The nations have sunk down into the pit that they have made; their own foot is caught in the net which they hid! I could get into all this fire & brimstone mallarkey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CXC3000 Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 Give examples then? Dictators that we're propping up. Can't get any more 'example-like' than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecky Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 Dictators that we're propping up. Can't get any more 'example-like' than that. What's all this, "We're," talk? Name these dictators then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CXC3000 Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 What's all this, "We're," talk? Name these dictators then. They're all over the Middle East and Africa, Mecks. Not sure what they're called, but they're there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mj.scuba Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 Indeed, so let's put it another way. If Anjem Choudary was deriding Jews and Christians (as he often does), his view wouldn't be considered in the same way as say Yasmin Alibhai-Brown, a moderate Muslim's view would be. Anjem Choudary is an Islmamic extremists who has been part of banned organisations and wishes to bring us all under a fascist ideology. If Choudary is meant to be like Melannie Phillips, it's a bad example unless your suggesting Melanie is some kind of Jewish extremist wishing to enforce Judaism on us all. Somebody like Salma Yaqoob would have been a better choice, imo. Anyway without wishing to take the thread any further off topic, I get your general point, whilst disagreeing with it somewhat slightly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecky Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 They're all over the Middle East and Africa, Mecks. Not sure what they're called, but they're there You're as much as a waste of space as that MelTheBel. It wouldn't surprise me if you turned out to be the same person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CXC3000 Posted August 1, 2011 Share Posted August 1, 2011 Anjem Choudary is an Islmamic extremists who has been part of banned organisations and wishes to bring us all under a fascist ideology. Many say Choudhry is under the auspices of MI5. The people who follow him are just useful idiots. You're as much as a waste of space as that MelTheBel. It wouldn't surprise me if you turned out to be the same person. Oooh, paranoia, Mecks; I'm beginning to get worried about you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.