Rich Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 Hey, i'm deadly with a tape measure! I may start a new martial art in fact! What? You a black belt in Origami? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cavegirl Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 Most people in society have a lot to do already... How much time do you spend volunteering every week? Too many criminals are already abusing the system there for them, that regulated, checked, double checked system run by qualified people... Imagine the problems that would arise if you let the grumpy old man from down the road be in charge with a 1940's mentality to sorting modern problems out, or the EDL to take over, or Anarchists... Madness! I tried to get involved a few years ago in some stuff going on round the estate I live, i'm still getting grief for it off people i've never even met, because of gang culture and the lack of real powers the Police has and too many do gooding social workers who haven't got a clue about the real world! I'm currently volunteering with others to try to set up a local community centre at which I plan to teach voluntarily and I offer the food I grow to Grow Sheffield who distributes the food to the local community. My partner helps out at a local ethnic minority centre and volunteers with an environmental community group. We do this on top of our day jobs- it's not impossible and has many rewards. We live in a centre-right increasingly neo-liberal society so of course it's tough to get involved with your community, few others are doing it and there's no real help from the government. It's simply not promoted in any significant way. However, with a big enough social movement from the bottom up that situation will get much easier, community members will get more support from each other and gradually we could have real change in gangland neighbourhoods. As much as I'd like us to become an anarcho-communist society I realise it would take a fundamental shift in social attitude to acheive this, but still, in terms of dealing with social class issues the leftwing ideologies have always been ahead of the game in terms of providing useful ideas aimed at reducing inequality, racial tension, class issues, crime and poverty compared to the right wing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swampster Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 They already discussed it on PMQ's this lunchtime! Basically the councils already have the power and it's up to them... Indeed they do, we had a problematic group around our area.. and after a bit of a concerted effort by the community these youths were identified, and their parents threatened with eviction if their kids didn't start behaving. Things so far have improved considerably. However, this 'petition' imo is more typical divisive spin that's being heavily employed in this country at present. Painting these rioters as all being Council house, benefit recipients.. or all council tenants and benefit recipients are all feckless work-shy scum.. when those 'facts' simply aren't true. Notwithstanding, what happens to an individual convicted of rioting who lives in private rental, or owns their own property in the area? Should they be evicted? As far as justice is concerned it should always be applied in equal measure.. so I guess the answer to that is yes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just_words Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 Indeed they do, we had a problematic group around our area.. and after a bit of a concerted effort by the community these youths were identified, and their parents threatened with eviction if their kids didn't start behaving. Things so far have improved considerably. However, this 'petition' imo is more typical divisive spin that's being heavily employed in this country at present. Painting these rioters as all being Council house, benefit recipients.. or all council tenants and benefit recipients are all feckless work-shy scum.. when those 'facts' simply aren't true. Notwithstanding, what happens to an individual convicted of rioting who lives in private rental, or owns their own property in the area? Should they be evicted? As far as justice is concerned it should always be applied in equal measure.. so I guess the answer to that is yes! Hmmm, not sure about the private landords position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just_words Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 What? You a black belt in Origami? I've got your measure! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swampster Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 Hmmm, not sure about the private landords position. Why, what makes them any more worthy not to receive the same punishment if they are convicted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andygardener Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 Indeed they do, we had a problematic group around our area.. and after a bit of a concerted effort by the community these youths were identified, and their parents threatened with eviction if their kids didn't start behaving. Things so far have improved considerably. However, this 'petition' imo is more typical divisive spin that's being heavily employed in this country at present. Painting these rioters as all being Council house, benefit recipients.. or all council tenants and benefit recipients are all feckless work-shy scum.. when those 'facts' simply aren't true. Notwithstanding, what happens to an individual convicted of rioting who lives in private rental, or owns their own property in the area? Should they be evicted? As far as justice is concerned it should always be applied in equal measure.. so I guess the answer to that is yes! I suppose the fairest way would be to ensure that banks would be allowed to cancell mortgages for convicted rioters if they chose to and that private landlords would be allowed to cancel tennancy agreements with convicted rioters if they chose to. The key point behind the concept is as I understand it that council housing is highly subsidised, so those who have violently attacked society rendering many homeless should not expect that same society to subsidise a roof over their heads. The practicalities are certainly problematic but i don't disagree with the broad principle that the victims council tax should not be used to subsidise the lifestyles of the rioters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just_words Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 I'm currently volunteering with others to try to set up a local community centre at which I plan to teach voluntarily and I offer the food I grow to Grow Sheffield who distributes the food to the local community. My partner helps out at a local ethnic minority centre and volunteers with an environmental community group. We do this on top of our day jobs- it's not impossible and has many rewards. We live in a centre-right increasingly neo-liberal society so of course it's tough to get involved with your community, few others are doing it and there's no real help from the government. It's simply not promoted in any significant way. However, with a big enough social movement from the bottom up that situation will get much easier, community members will get more support from each other and gradually we could have real change in gangland neighbourhoods. As much as I'd like us to become an anarcho-communist society I realise it would take a fundamental shift in social attitude to acheive this, but still, in terms of dealing with social class issues the leftwing ideologies have always been ahead of the game in terms of providing useful ideas aimed at reducing inequality, racial tension, class issues, crime and poverty compared to the right wing. Well done, a true example. I used to volunteer, but not currently, even though I do go out of my way to help others... Personally I see anarcho-communist as a pipe dream, literally. Life will always have a hierarchy, you just can't get away from that. Also if you could show me a communist society which has survived longer than 50 years without turning into a dictatorship or imploding... Every now and again with various people I bring up the subject of removing capitalism, but it would take a whole lot of automated infrastructure to do, but even then there would still be hierarchy. Who would ever sit at school dreaming of being a bin man? Who would want to work extra hard after numerous years of extra study for the same wage of a menial position... We need incentive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just_words Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 Why, what makes them any more worthy not to receive the same punishment if they are convicted? a) If they own the property, what can you do? This crime doesn't warrant seizing of such property unless due to the failure to pay fines. b) for them to evict, it'd probably depend on the contracts they use... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulgarian Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 private landlords would be allowed to cancel tennancy agreements with convicted rioters if they chose to. Why would they if the tenant is paying them rent, it's not the landlords job to be their moral judge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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