Is David Starkey Right ?

[Longcol]

I think there was a certain naivity when there was mass immigration in the 1950's/60's that ethnic minorities would just leave their culture at the port of their home country and automatically take on board the pervading British culture as eagerly as they would take the jobs that were offered them.

 

You could easily say that about any "community" that was transported to another place. When I was a kid in the '50's the pit village I lived in had a mass influx (like a whole new estate that increased the population by about 25%) - predominantly Geordies and Scots.

 

The "locals" had only been there for a generation or two and had mainly come from Lancashire, North Derbyshire and Castleford / Pontefract.

 

50 years on parts of the village are still referred to as "the Geordie Estate" and "Little Lancashire".

[kimba]

You could easily say that about any "community" that was transported to another place. When I was a kid in the '50's the pit village I lived in had a mass influx (like a whole new estate that increased the population by about 25%) - predominantly Geordies and Scots.

 

The "locals" had only been there for a generation or two and had mainly come from Lancashire, North Derbyshire and Castleford / Pontefract.

 

50 years on parts of the village are still referred to as "the Geordie Estate" and "Little Lancashire".

Did they change the dialect of where you lived all those years on ?

 

I ask because there are swathes of white kids all over the country now that speak like they are black gangster rappers and now prefer the life with no prospects that is the only option to a huge proportion of the black population in the US where it was spawned from, rather than try make something of themselves with the opportunities that this country offers.

 

Those who adopt the attitude to make the most out of education here have quite an advantage over the black youth in the US where being a gangster is not a lifestyle choice but quite possibly the only way of life open to some.

 

I see loads of people posing now with the fingers out mimicking a gun and think to myself 'you total prat'.

[boyfriday]

Did they change the dialect of where you lived all those years on ?

If white chavs are emulating black ones, they're certainly not emulating Jamaican ones..the black kids are mainly teenagers, they were born here, their parents were born here and there's a good chance their grand parents were born here too. Most have probably never seen the Caribbean in their lives.

I ask because there are swathes of white kids all over the country now that speak like they are black gangster rappers and now prefer the life with no prospects that is the only option to a huge proportion of the black population in the US where it was spawned from, rather than try make something of themselves with the opportunities that this country offers.

..and that's the issue, they're emulating a commercialised, American stereotype, the one they see on the television. Their 'mentors' don't have to live here to influence them.

 

I see loads of people posing now with the fingers out mimicking a gun and think to myself 'you total prat'.

I think the same, but kids posing like 'gangstas' doesn't mean they are, it's what kids do, try and look hard and more mature than they are.

[six45ive]

You could easily say that about any "community" that was transported to another place. When I was a kid in the '50's the pit village I lived in had a mass influx (like a whole new estate that increased the population by about 25%) - predominantly Geordies and Scots.

 

The "locals" had only been there for a generation or two and had mainly come from Lancashire, North Derbyshire and Castleford / Pontefract.

 

50 years on parts of the village are still referred to as "the Geordie Estate" and "Little Lancashire".

 

I'm not making any judgement Longcol, simply stating the facts of the matter while

making the point that things may have been done differently with less naivity and more hindsight.

 

In my experience, differing cultures always have and always will try and dominate each other either by force, disruption or by more subversive means. It's simply human nature.

[kimba]

I agree with all you put BF in reply to my post.

 

Its nothing that's stemmed from Jamaica where the majority of our black and black/white mixed race citizens have come from,but from the US where for years black people have struggled under the dominant white population there.

 

Blacks in the US have found it hard to break into the out of the getto's of the US where the likes of the Irish and other white Europeans managed to.

Its only quite recent in the scale of things that any progress has really been made in the US and there is still huge areas of predominantly black communities where there are no prospects and its out of this background that crime, drug dealing and gangster/gangland mentality has arisen.

Its Ideology has made it here with none of the actual back drop and comparison to everyday life here. In effect the people that live the gangster lifestyle here that is born out of the black communities in the US are actually living a fictitious made up lifestyle with no roots other than what the media has brought to our shores. Kids needing to substitute the gun with their fingers to try and live within the realms of that fantasy lifestyle.

Its ok if its a fashion thing but it inevitably bleeds over into real life where kids do start selling drugs, obtaining guns or carrying knives. Then when they gain the reputation withing that world, they feel that they have to protect it and end up killing or dieing for it.

Most of them have turned their back on the common language here and adapted their own to fit into the delusional lifestyle they have taken on

 

Corporate companies of the US have taken the misery of the black American and made a brand of it, exporting it around the globe to where ever black descendants of the slave trade may have settled as they are willing to buy into and can empathize with the misery.

They have marketed the struggle to survive, turning out music, games and TV programs to the new found consumers and doing it how huge corporations do it best, with no moral

or ethical attachment.

 

In effect the white American is still keeping the black population second class with by branding their own misery and selling it back to them.

 

Broken Britain, or greedy corporate ethics of the largest capitalistic nation in the world ?

[Jeffrey Shaw]

We are to blame for this by wanting a multi racial country in the first place.

No, "we" aren't; and no, "we" didn't. But it's here now, so we have to deal with it.

[boyfriday]

I agree with all you put BF in reply to my post.

 

Its nothing that's stemmed from Jamaica where the majority of our black and black/white mixed race citizens have come from,but from the US where for years black people have struggled under the dominant white population there.

 

Blacks in the US have found it hard to break into the out of the getto's of the US where the likes of the Irish and other white Europeans managed to.

Its only quite recent in the scale of things that any progress has really been made in the US and there is still huge areas of predominantly black communities where there are no prospects and its out of this background that crime, drug dealing and gangster/gangland mentality has arisen.

Its Ideology has made it here with none of the actual back drop and comparison to everyday life here. In effect the people that live the gangster lifestyle here that is born out of the black communities in the US are actually living a fictitious made up lifestyle with no roots other than what the media has brought to our shores. Kids needing to substitute the gun with their fingers to try and live within the realms of that fantasy lifestyle.

Its ok if its a fashion thing but it inevitably bleeds over into real life where kids do start selling drugs, obtaining guns or carrying knives. Then when they gain the reputation withing that world, they feel that they have to protect it and end up killing or dieing for it.

Most of them have turned their back on the common language here and adapted their own to fit into the delusional lifestyle they have taken on

 

Corporate companies of the US have taken the misery of the black American and made a brand of it, exporting it around the globe to where ever black descendants of the slave trade may have settled as they are willing to buy into and can empathize with the misery.

They have marketed the struggle to survive, turning out music, games and TV programs to the new found consumers and doing it how huge corporations do it best, with no moral

or ethical attachment.

 

In effect the white American is still keeping the black population second class with by branding their own misery and selling it back to them.

 

Broken Britain, or greedy corporate ethics of the largest capitalistic nation in the world ?

 

Flippin ell, was that all your own work kimba?

 

A*

[kimba]

Flippin ell, was that all your own work kimba?

 

A*

Of course its all my own work cheeky

 

I think its bang on the money, though realizing a situation is not a solution to it.

 

The likes of Cameron will not look into it this in depth, that's the advantage of being a no one on a forum no one may read, We can tell it like it is and not have to circumvent the problem like the people Governments do.

[donkey]

Is that a posh way of saying they talk t'drivel?

 

The indigenous Britons are good at making stone tools and spearing woolly mamals, but they tend to be a bit below average when it comes to critical thinking!

[Quinnwok]

Dr David starkey is 100% correct, 100%. Until this issue is confronted nothing will improve.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14513517

 

I was not offended by his well thought out comments.