mj.scuba Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Indeed to me that is the embodiment of Conservativism. You don't have to be happy with your lot, it's ok to aspire to do better for yourself and your family, and with hard work you can achieve things regardless of your background. That's why I can never understand people that have a go at working class Tories, as though wanting to better ones self is a bad thing The two most important people in the Tory party are both Eton educated blue bloods. Who in the Tory cabinet has worked their way up from a working class background? They have all come up from rich families, via public schools and university courses almost exclusively reserved for a wealthy elite. You should trust the evidence that is in front of your eyes, over such banal propaganda and hollow sloganeering. Do you believe the opposite then? That people from less well off backgrounds cannot achieve things, even with hard work? I suppose you're the sort of person that thinks working class people should stick to their 'working class jobs' and shouldn't go to University, since you think they can't achieve much? -- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandad.Malky Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 It seems to me that if you're a working class Tory, then the working class hate you and the rich Tories really hate you. Is that why..... “I used to drink 14 pints a day” , Hauge wasn’t too popular? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Bourne Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Is that why..... “I used to drink 14 pints a day” , Hauge wasn’t too popular? Hague v Blair was quite interesting. One went to the local comp, the other studied at a posh school Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mj.scuba Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Is that why..... “I used to drink 14 pints a day” , Hauge wasn’t too popular? He was so unpopular, they elected him to be their leader Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandad.Malky Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 He was so unpopular, they elected him to be their leader Miliband is the currant Labour leader put to you thing he will be around for that long ………. Some politicians are leaders others are just cannon fodder. Hague’s popularity soared when he resigned was the in joke amongst conservatives wasn’t it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titanic99 Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Do you believe the opposite then? That people from less well off backgrounds cannot achieve things, even with hard work? I suppose you're the sort of person that thinks working class people should stick to their 'working class jobs' and shouldn't go to University, since you think they can't achieve much? -- It depends on what you mean by achieving things, if these are materialistic then they need money and to get a lot of this they need to have exceptional business skills. Unfortunately those with other exceptional skills will never achieve these things unless they get lucky in the lottery. Whether or not people who can buy/produce things and then sell them on to someone at a higher price are more deserving of this wealth, than someone who for example saves lives as a paramedic is a debatable point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donkey Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Do you believe the opposite then? That people from less well off backgrounds cannot achieve things, even with hard work? -- No, I don't believe that. My own Father was raised in the depression and during the war by a single parent alcoholic Irish immigrant mother who had seven other kids. He educated himself and provided far better opportunities for us concerning education and social mobility than he himself had ever had. He is not so naive as to believe the crass propaganda that the opportunities he took were created for him by the ruling class and it's main political outlet - the tory party - and neither am I. I suppose you're the sort of person that thinks working class people should stick to their 'working class jobs' and shouldn't go to University, since you think they can't achieve much? -- I am a self employed removals man. I am half way to a degree as a mature student, which I am funding myself, so you could scarcely be more wrong. I'm sure if you could make a reasonable case for your assertion that the Tories create opportunites for social mobility, you wouldn't feel the need to resort to such wildly inaccurate and insolent speculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harvey19 Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 No, I don't believe that. My own Father was raised in the depression and during the war by an alcoholic Irish immigrant mother who had seven other kids. He educated himself and provided far better opportunities for us concerning education and social mobility than he himself had ever had himself. He is not so naeve as to believe the crass propaganda that the opportunities he took were created for him the ruling class and it's main political outlet - the tory party - and neither am I. The Labour party was the saviour of many people but Keir Hardy and Tony Blair are completely different entities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mj.scuba Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Miliband is the currant Labour leader put to you thing he will be around for that long ………. Some politicians are leaders others are just cannon fodder. Hague’s popularity soared when he resigned was the in joke amongst conservatives wasn’t it? I think Hague has matured somewhat since his ill fated single issue 'keep the pound' General Election campaign, in fact I think he'd make a good leader and PM now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anna B Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Do you believe the opposite then? That people from less well off backgrounds cannot achieve things, even with hard work? I suppose you're the sort of person that thinks working class people should stick to their 'working class jobs' and shouldn't go to University, since you think they can't achieve much? -- Social mobility is becoming a thing of the past. Working class people may be just as clever and talented but don't get the opportunities that the middle and upper classes do. And many of the chances that the post war baby boomers had (thanks largely to the post war Labour Party) no longer exist, in particular, a good general education, free university education and full employment. As the baby-boomers-made-good work their way out of the system, I doubt there will be many similar state educated working class to take their place. In many occupations,eg Police, it is no longer possible to work your way up from the shop floor as managerial positions are only filled by graduates. Even Nursing now requires a degree. Also the only way in to a number of sought after jobs is via internships, but working class people cannot afford to work for free, and of course it helps to know the right people, have the right connections, friends of Daddy etc. and very few working class have influential friends and family who can get them through the door. There will always be exceptions of course, and good luck to them, but statistically, taking into account the vast number of working class compared with a comparatively few middle and upper, the working class are massively under represented at the top. And it is getting worse. Which is why we have 20+ multi-millionaires in the cabinet. What are the statistical chances of that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.