John X Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 I'm afraid it's the most prolific playing of the 'race card' here and it's done by the nationalists "I can't say what I want to say because I'll be called a racist" accompanied by fake tears Maybe we need a discussion about the discussion of immigration itself. If I was seriously anti-immigration on economic grounds, I would do my best to dissociate myself and my views from the likes of the BNP and the EDL. There are a small number of posters on here who do that and they never use the "I can't discuss this without being called a racist" argument. They put their argument forward sensibly, without constant links to migrationwatch's spurious statistics, Daily Mail articles or cut and pasting parts of completely baseless speculation which is taken as absolute truth. The language used in some posts reveals the true feelings of the poster who can't quite disguise their dislike for those of a different ethnicity. The BNP and EDL are not constitutionally racist organisations BUT the majority of members of both organisations are racist. So those who defend them as legitimate political organisations whose existance show that there is widespread concern about immigration, do themselves no favours when trying to claim to be anti-immigration but not racist. My 'contentious' signature says stirring up "anti-immigrant feelings", not "anti-immigration feelings". Surely no-one can disagree with that? So to those who do think that immigration is a topic worthy of discussion I say, "Play the ball, not the man" If you play the man you will justly be accused of being racist and quite rightly shown the red card. John X Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conrod Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 So those who defend them as legitimate political organisations whose existance show that there is widespread concern about immigration, do themselves no favours when trying to claim to be anti-immigration but not racist.Do you feel it is possible to be anti-immigration without being racist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retep Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 ..and good riddance to them. The costs of processing and deporting 150 is hardly a major consideration in the scheme of things is it? Probably about the same in costs terms as the revenue that 20 foreign students bring into the country. I wonder what the costs have been of processing and deporting English football fans from the countries they've trashed over the years? Ps: How can someone born here be an immigrant? The cost of keeping them inside prison is around £40,000 a year. For an immigration removal centre, this rises to as much as £50,000. Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1351185/80m-year-cost-foreign-criminals-UK-deport.html#ixzz1VYxRm5Fw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 The cost of keeping them inside prison is around £40,000 a year. For an immigration removal centre, this rises to as much as £50,000. Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1351185/80m-year-cost-foreign-criminals-UK-deport.html#ixzz1VYxRm5Fw Crikey, the Daily Mail links are running thick & furious this morning! Hopefully, they won't be around in an immigration removal centre for long having been convicted of a serious criminal offence. How much revenue do you think a foreign student brings into the UK over the period of a 3/4 year course? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Do you feel it is possible to be anti-immigration without being racist? Well it's a fine line isn't it? What do you mean by "anti-immigration"? Do you mean against immigration totally or do you mean advocating a sensibly constructed immigration policy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John X Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Do you feel it is possible to be anti-immigration without being racist? Of course it is! John X Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retep Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Crikey, the Daily Mail links are running thick & furious this morning! Hopefully, they won't be around in an immigration removal centre for long having been convicted of a serious criminal offence. How much revenue do you think a foreign student brings into the UK over the period of a 3/4 year course? How do you think they are going to remove them, with the appeals upon appeals, what do you think the total cost will be. Looking at the £50,000 cost a year, do the students bring that amount into the country a year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Sidney Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 ..and good riddance to them. The costs of processing and deporting 150 is hardly a major consideration in the scheme of things is it? Probably about the same in costs terms as the revenue that 20 foreign students bring into the country. I wonder what the costs have been of processing and deporting English football fans from the countries they've trashed over the years? Ps: How can someone born here be an immigrant? The 150 are only those born overseas. I don't really care but can't accept the imaginary and sight handicapped view that the immigrant population was not over represented during the riots. I highlighted the 150 because issues like this are not included in the calculations for cost of immigration. There are thousands of other hidden costs not included in the data. This is not a race issue, its an honesty issue. Out of all the people who post on here I'm the one who has the most sympathy for the people involved in the rioting, both black and white. So to me, singularly, its not an issue of blaming any one section. Its an issue of accepting the facts. Without this we can't ensure that it won't happen again. Your calculations, along with many others, are seriously flawed. The student comparison you mention only included the "revenue" they bring in as though that is entirely profit for the country. It doesn't include the cost of public services the students use when they're here. In relation to your PS. PS You're not an immigrant if you're born here but you wouldn't have been born here unless for immigration. I don't know what English football hooligans have to do with a debate about immigration but anyway lets put that to bed. Unfortunately, for you, I've spent a lot of my life around "football hooligans." Do you know why the Birmingham City football hooligans are called "The Zulus" well, Mr F, its because a large percentage of them are black. Do you know the colour of a now departed leader of the BBC, that's the Blades Business Crew. He was black. Anyway I can't see the logic in pointing out other social problems when debating immigration, its kind of desperation because your argument is failing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John X Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 How do you think they are going to remove them, with the appeals upon appeals, what do you think the total cost will be. If your argument is based simply on economic grounds rather than xenophobia, then maybe you should accept that it may be cheaper to allow someone to stay rather than deport them. John X Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Sidney Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Well it's a fine line isn't it? What do you mean by "anti-immigration"? Do you mean against immigration totally or do you mean advocating a sensibly constructed immigration policy? I don't feel its racist to be totally against immigration. I am, for now, because I feel the cost to the people already here is too great. That included the cost to immigrants already here.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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