retep Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 Sorry was that scissor kick intended to scorch the back of my net or whack you in the mouth? Are you suggesting the unemployment rate amongst blacks is due to their no longer following Christianity? No just asserting your claim that they've fallen by the wayside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 I'm sure you're right that future generations of Muslims will 'mellow' as they edge closer to mainstream values and culture - that much one would expect. But I don't think the situation reflects the 70’s quite so closely – even if we ignore the deeper cultural division we have now, the main difference is numbers. Back in the 70’s, immigration led to ‘token’ black kids in classes in most schools, obviously in some areas more, in other areas none, but the numbers overall were relatively trivial. We now have more than a quarter of all primary school kids from ethnic minorities – can you not acknowledge this to represent a blisteringly rapid change to UK demographics in almost impossibly short time? Yes of course it's a change to the demographic, but there's a temptation when acknowledging that to arrive at the kind of sensational conclusions the OP has done. The ethnic landscape in the UK has changed over the last 60 years, there have always been immigrants that have come here but the ones that don't look like the 'indigenous' are superficially easier to spot and therefore attract concern. (As for your (undoubtedly handsome) grandkids – what do you mean they might look more like me than you – do you think I’m white or something? ) LOL, it don't matter big boy, they'll (hopefully) cover all racial/ethnic bases Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 No just asserting your claim that they've fallen by the wayside. I was meaning from a theological point of view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danot Posted September 6, 2011 Author Share Posted September 6, 2011 Strange idea. I'm a 'sinner' in many religious eyes (Muslim included). I drink, i smoke and i'm not married to the mother of my children. Over the last four years, have a guess how many of the several jundred Muslims I know and have worked with have acalled me a sinner? Go on, you know you want to... OK, since you insist. Is it NONE of them? You never know Halibut, they might have a stone in their pocket just in case you commit a serious sin like drawing a picture of Mohamed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retep Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 I was meaning from a theological point of view. In which case its worse than you thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANGELFIRE1 Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 Islamification? Is that even a word? Aye, it certainly seems to be. http://www.google.co.uk/#sclient=psy&hl=en&source=hp&q=islamification+of+britain&pbx=1&oq=islamification&aq=1&aqi=g5&aql=&gs_sm=c&gs_upl=0l0l1l2572l0l0l0l0l0l0l0l0ll0l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=19ab328225c04449&biw=1400&bih=652 Regards Angel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 Posting a thread with the intention of making Islam the subject of critical debate doesn't make it a "Islam bashing thread", nor does it make the poster 'anti Islamic', or 'a racist, or 'color prejudice', or ' bigoted'. But it isn't 'critical debate' is it? That's what most of us wanted, but you derailed your own thread. You've unashamedly ignored facts that have been presented to you in order to continue ploughing a pre-determined furrow. Why should critical debates on Islam require more sensitivity than a critical debates on Christianity? They shouldn't and I don't believe I was suggesting they should, but arguing on the basis of suspicion and innuendo is about as critical as Katie Price offering an opinion on the Libyan crisis. I'll criticize both with equal enthusiasm without fear or favour to either. How many can say the same BF?Oh so it was the usual Islam/bible bashing thread then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conrod Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 Yes of course it's a change to the demographic, but there's a temptation when acknowledging that to arrive at the kind of sensational conclusions the OP has done. The ethnic landscape in the UK has changed over the last 60 years, there have always been immigrants that have come here but the ones that don't look like the 'indigenous' are superficially easier to spot and therefore attract concern. Yes, it has changed, at various times in the past and in different ways, but never either so rapidly or by such vast proportions. When the Vikings nipped over for a spot of rape and pillage, we didn't end up with a quarter of our kids being Vikings 20 years later. Ditto Romans/French/etc. The 'melting pot' of the population gets some new blood and we move on with a degree of benefit, as most nations have experienced one way or another, but the numbers involved here are staggering. Be assured it's not a case of me just not wanting people with brown skin to overwhelm England - I'm no more a supporter of the EDL/BNP types than I am of Al Qaeda - I think this level of immigration and population change would be unhealthy and difficult to work through for any nation. LOL, it don't matter big boy, they'll (hopefully) cover all racial/ethnic bases Now I think I'm deeply wounded - does 'big boy' mean I'm overweight, or are you making a pass at me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 In which case its worse than you thought. Oh not at all, I was well aware of the unemployment figure amongst blacks, young ones particularly-but highlighting it just doesn't seem relevant in a discussion about secularity of the UK and the threats to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 But it isn't 'critical debate' is it? That's what most of us wanted, but you derailed your own thread. You've unashamedly ignored facts that have been presented to you in order to continue ploughing a pre-determined furrow. They shouldn't and I don't believe I was suggesting they should, but arguing on the basis of suspicion and innuendo is about as critical as Katie Price offering an opinion on the Libyan crisis. Oh so it was the usual Islam/bible bashing thread then? I think I see the problem here. By critical debate you mean using intelligence and analytical thought to examine assertions and not simply accepting the status quo. Danot means simply to say negative things. crit·i·calAdjective/ˈkritikəl/ 1. Expressing adverse or disapproving judgments: "critical of many US programs". 2. Expressing or involving an analysis of a an assertion or statement: "she never won the critical acclaim she sought". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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