epiphany Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 I recently had an epiphany (I rarely have epiphanies). I don't have to do anything. I don't have to get out of bed in the morning. I don't have to eat healthily. I don't have to work. I don't have to help others. I don't have to go to that doctor's appointment. I don't have to pay my bills or taxes. I don't have to do a thing. "Ah, but what about the consequences of not doing these things?", I hear you ask. Well let me put this to you. If the worst thing that can happen is you live the rest of your life descending into abject poverty, imprisonment, or even die "before your time" because of your refusal to do anything, you would surely take comfort in the fact that even if you did bother to do those things, you'd still eventually turn into the same space dust as those who didn't. Everything you have to show for your infinitesimally short, albeit perhaps noble (at least relative to other human beings) existence will eventually turn to dust. Another 6 billion years WILL pass. Can you picture that point in time? Who are you and where is everything around you? That time is as good as passed, as its arrival is so certain. So it really does not matter, in the absolute fullest sense of the word, if I don't do anything. Don't get me wrong, I probably will get out of bed, try to eat healthily, work, try to help others, go to that doctor's appointment and pay my bills and taxes, but my god it's a relief to know I don't have to do them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proximus Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 You're right but surely the whole thing that seperates "life" from just "living" is the joy and pleasure as well as results and satisfaction that can be gained from doing many of the things you mention. Ok some of the things are difficult, costly or not always fun but the piece of mind and reward you get from doing them outweighs the negative impact they may or may not have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 I recently had an epiphany (I rarely have epiphanies). I don't have to do anything. I don't have to get out of bed in the morning. I don't have to eat healthily. I don't have to work. I don't have to help others. I don't have to go to that doctor's appointment. I don't have to pay my bills or taxes. I don't have to do a thing. "Ah, but what about the consequences of not doing these things?", I hear you ask. Well let me put this to you. If the worst thing that can happen is you live the rest of your life descending into abject poverty, imprisonment, or even die "before your time" because of your refusal to do anything, you would surely take comfort in the fact that even if you did bother to do those things, you'd still eventually turn into the same space dust as those who didn't. Everything you have to show for your infinitesimally short, albeit perhaps noble (at least relative to other human beings) existence will eventually turn to dust. Another 6 billion years WILL pass. Can you picture that point in time? Who are you and where is everything around you? That time is as good as passed, as its arrival is so certain. So it really does not matter, in the absolute fullest sense of the word, if I don't do anything. Don't get me wrong, I probably will get out of bed, try to eat healthily, work, try to help others, go to that doctor's appointment and pay my bills and taxes, but my god it's a relief to know I don't have to do them. Doesn't this line of thought result in some form of hedonism. Do whatever makes you happiest in life, since none of it really matters. Personally I work because that provides me with the ability to do things that I enjoy in my free time. Call it long term hedonism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epiphany Posted September 21, 2011 Author Share Posted September 21, 2011 You're right but surely the whole thing that seperates "life" from just "living" is the joy and pleasure as well as results and satisfaction that can be gained from doing many of the things you mention. Ok some of the things are difficult, costly or not always fun but the piece of mind and reward you get from doing them outweighs the negative impact they may or may not have? True, but the peace of mind I am talking about is that which is found in the realisation that you do not have to do anything. People (including myself) treat negative consequences as the reason why you must do certain things. I am saying that, eventually, the consequence of living a good life vs a bad life are the same, and simply knowing this relieves you of a self imposed master-slave relationship that causes procrastination and resentment among other negatives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epiphany Posted September 21, 2011 Author Share Posted September 21, 2011 Doesn't this line of thought result in some form of hedonism. Do whatever makes you happiest in life, since none of it really matters. Personally I work because that provides me with the ability to do things that I enjoy in my free time. Call it long term hedonism. Call me cynical, but I believe that is the true nature of humanity. Everything we do, even the seemingly altruistic, leads right back to our own self gratification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 As long as self gratification includes empathy and social behaviour then I can't see why that would be a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickycheese Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Doesn't this line of thought result in some form of hedonism. Do whatever makes you happiest in life, since none of it really matters. Personally I work because that provides me with the ability to do things that I enjoy in my free time. Call it long term hedonism. I would have thought that it leads to nihilism, as it doesn't matter whether you've had a happy life or not; the result is the same. Surely this is the only possible conclusion of atheism - we're just atoms in a temporary state no different from a stone. As someone who's logic leads to atheism I find it both reassuring AND disturbing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Maybe that depends on your personality. If it doesn't matter then personally I'd choose to have as much fun as possible before I die (in fact that's pretty much how I live my life, but taking the long view on how to achieve maximum satisfaction). If you were a negative person then it might result in nihilism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickycheese Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 But why is hedonism 'positive' - if nothing is of any importance, then it does not matter whether you are happy or not - 'pleasure' is just the chemistry of your body acting in a slightly different manner with no consequence. If you are not around after death, then it doesn't matter if you had a 'fun' life or not. If you go for a night out and get so drunk that you can't remember it the next day, then it doesn't matter whether you had a great night or a lousy one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epiphany Posted September 21, 2011 Author Share Posted September 21, 2011 I would have thought that it leads to nihilism, as it doesn't matter whether you've had a happy life or not; the result is the same. Surely this is the only possible conclusion of atheism - we're just atoms in a temporary state no different from a stone. As someone who's logic leads to atheism I find it both reassuring AND disturbing... Nihilism can (perhaps oxymoronically) give birth to the most enlightened of meaning, since the nihilist truly understands the big picture - that everything is relative and equally (in)significant. A great weight is lifted because the nihilist sees everything at peace with itself, including his own awareness of joy and suffering and the fact he is biologically programmed to avoid such suffering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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