LDeville Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 raising the minimum wage might encourage people to stop living off the dole and cut the benefit bill Hi The workshy and the minim wage, the two have no relationship to each other in anyway, fact. Hosuing association rents in London in nice new areas where people are paying in excess of 250k for one bedroom flats is around 1200 quid. when a person makes a decsion not to work and is maried and couple of kids under 16 and living in a 3 bedroom HA house they do not pay rent or council taxt so staright away savings of 15000 quid a month net equating to 2400 gross monthly, so that is why they decide not to work or work legally. (not saying all are like that, just 66%) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chem1st Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 You don't seem to have realised that some small BTL landlords have lost money, and sometimes their properties when mortgage rates were high. Some find it difficult to get tenants who stick to their side of a rental agreement too. If someone had worked hard, managed to save some money and bought property as an investment for retirement they could end up with nothing. Any investment can go wrong. Some big BTL landlords have lost money. (Which is a good thing - however, that loss of money has been shifted onto the state, the taxpayer is having to bail them out, after been a rent yielding tenant). What happens and has happened when this type of exploitative investment goes wrong? These people go bankrupt. Debts go unpaid. These BTL ****s are normally in debt up to their eyeballs. The bank takes the loss. The banks then goes running to mummy and daddy state. The taxpayer has been forced to bail out the banks. We've had, and will have money printing. Inflation, inflation, inflation This destroys the value of any savings in £. It's destroying wages in real term. Subsequently YOUR pension is destroyed, as its value is eroded by inflation. These people need to be forced to pay off their debt, but they can walk away from it, and within a year, they can start doing the same thing again. They suck wealth from the economy and do so using debt, when it goes wrong the taxpayer bails them out. Further wealth is sucked from the economy. The working man is robbed twice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickiethecat Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 The minimum wage can only work if every country in the world has a minimum wage. Otherwise companies will continue to leave the UK and set up factories and call centres in places like India and China where wages costs will be a fraction of those in the UK. As there's no way China and India would ever bring in a minimum wage, we should get rid of it here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 The government could, lets say, "encourage" morgage lenders and landlords etc, to be a bit more realistic with their pricing. Mortgage lenders don't price anything, and encouraging them to be responsible means not letting them lend higher than 3 - 4 times someones income. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike84 Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 Some big BTL landlords have lost money. (Which is a good thing - however, that loss of money has been shifted onto the state, the taxpayer is having to bail them out, after been a rent yielding tenant). What happens and has happened when this type of exploitative investment goes wrong? These people go bankrupt. Debts go unpaid. These BTL ****s are normally in debt up to their eyeballs. The bank takes the loss. The banks then goes running to mummy and daddy state. The taxpayer has been forced to bail out the banks. We've had, and will have money printing. Inflation, inflation, inflation This destroys the value of any savings in £. It's destroying wages in real term. Subsequently YOUR pension is destroyed, as its value is eroded by inflation. These people need to be forced to pay off their debt, but they can walk away from it, and within a year, they can start doing the same thing again. They suck wealth from the economy and do so using debt, when it goes wrong the taxpayer bails them out. Further wealth is sucked from the economy. The working man is robbed twice. The way you pin the worlds economy and current financial problems on landlords is hilarious. You really have got a bee in your bonnet about it. Your posts on the subject are starting to border on lunacy and are slightly boring. The state does not have a reponsibility to provide a house for everyone. People need to buck their ideas up, get off their backsides and provide from them selves. There has been landlords renting property in the UK for hundreds of years, this will NEVER change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike84 Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 The minimum wage can only work if every country in the world has a minimum wage. Otherwise companies will continue to leave the UK and set up factories and call centres in places like India and China where wages costs will be a fraction of those in the UK. As there's no way China and India would ever bring in a minimum wage, we should get rid of it here. How is going back to paying people less that £3 p/h going to help the UK?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampersand Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 The minimum wage can only work if every country in the world has a minimum wage. Otherwise companies will continue to leave the UK and set up factories and call centres in places like India and China where wages costs will be a fraction of those in the UK. As there's no way China and India would ever bring in a minimum wage, we should get rid of it here. IN what way is the minimum wage classed as "not working" Companies and businesses relocate for many reasons, local wage costs only being one of them, and the relative importance of it to their decision will vary from business to business The minimum wage wasn't, as far as I am aware, ever intended as a method of attracting companies based overseas to relocate here, so why should that be a measure of whether or not it is "working" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 Housing benefit is forcing up rents. housing benefit forces up house prices. If a 2bed house yields £5408, and costs £100000, then that's a 5.408% yield. (Far higher than what you will get in a bank) That's assuming that there are no costs to being a landlord. Even ignoring the cost of your own time spent managing the situation, you have to pay for maintenance and upkeep, landlords generally pay the water rates, they need buildings insurance, in most cases they provide furnishings which need replacing periodically, and they definitely provide fittings. So your far higher yield than a bank, just got chopped in half due to outgoings and is now lower than you can get from a 12 month bond. Yet to qualify for a £5408 mortgage, one would need a salary of £30k. I.e. you'd have to be in the top 20% of earners. Eh? A 2bed house, shouldn't cost more than £30k. They cost more than that 20 years ago, when earning 30k would have put you in the top 5% or higher of earners. Lax lending let prices explode, but housing benefit keeps them propped up. I don't see how, the rental market doesn't determine house prices, and housing benefit is a lowest common denominator, not something lifting the cost of rental up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chem1st Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 That's assuming that there are no costs to being a landlord. Even ignoring the cost of your own time spent managing the situation, you have to pay for maintenance and upkeep, landlords generally pay the water rates, they need buildings insurance, in most cases they provide furnishings which need replacing periodically, and they definitely provide fittings. So your far higher yield than a bank, just got chopped in half due to outgoings and is now lower than you can get from a 12 month bond. Eh? They cost more than that 20 years ago, when earning 30k would have put you in the top 5% or higher of earners. I don't see how, the rental market doesn't determine house prices, and housing benefit is a lowest common denominator, not something lifting the cost of rental up. I meant £100k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickiethecat Posted September 30, 2011 Share Posted September 30, 2011 How is going back to paying people less that £3 p/h going to help the UK?? In case you hadn't noticed there are about 3 million people unemployed. Better for a company to be paying them £3 an hour than the state giving them £100 a week to stay on the the dole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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