Tony Erikson Posted October 4, 2011 Share Posted October 4, 2011 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-15160326 Now frankly I think the BBC have been a bit biased in their reporting of this by sticking with the cat story. I heard parts of the speech today and wonder if you did. Do you think, cat aside, that she had any valid points? Is she right tampering with the Human Rights act? Was Ken Clarke right when he said we fought a war for those rights and they need protecting for all? Does section 8 need interpreting better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecky Posted October 4, 2011 Share Posted October 4, 2011 I've seen plenty of strange decisions made by Immigration Judges, like a decision to refuse leave was overturned at appeal because someone wanted to play chess on Wednesday afternoons even though that person was in the UK under a temporary category in the first place. This is not about Human rights or the immigration system which works, despite the fact that it is often abused by migrants, as any system would/will be, or even belittled by the media despite them knowing jack and are just trying to pander to/influence public opinion. This is about Immigration Judges who don't know what they are doing. You have the appellant (the person who was refused leave), the Respondent (the UKBA - More often than not the Presenting Officer does not turn up at appeal) and the Immigration Judge (who is independant on the immigration system/UKBA). Facts listed in the Immigration Rules do not often influence the Immigration Judges decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hard2miss Posted October 4, 2011 Share Posted October 4, 2011 100% Get it scrapped. For years before it we managed and any stick that foreign criminals can use to get to live here should be snapped into pieces. As soon as its gone we should start rounding people up and deport the blighters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJRB Posted October 4, 2011 Share Posted October 4, 2011 She didn't help her argument by including the cat reference,and gave he opponents a cheap shot of a response. That said,I certainly believe that all adult immigrants should understand that their residence is conditional on their observance of the laws of this country. This is a convenient sweeping statement and as always the devil is in the detail if such a law can be framed. What level of criminality would incur automatic expulsion.would it be linked to a prison sentence of a certain period. The Burnley case of an illegal immigrant who killed a little girl whilst uninsured and serving a driving ban is a case in point.He got a 4 month sentence having been tried for the technical offences only rather than causing death by dangerous driving.I believe he has previous for minor offences,and successfully resisted deportation because he has fathered children in the uk. Personally I would rather he was kicked out as a useless and dangerous addition to our population but how do you frame the law. I believe that others who have actively plotted against the uk population,and preach hatred against the west are also protected by the human rights issues. There must be a quid pro quo expected from anyone who chooses to live in an adopted country,but it will be interesting to see how this can be legislated,and if it is,how the legislation will be applied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElasticMan Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 Its not enough to sweep aside the ridiculous cat remark, as it demonstrates perfectly how out of touch this government is, and how hollow its opposition to the HRA is. To cite this as an example when it is 100% wrong shows that there is no merit in her case. It was either a deliberate lie, or a totally unchecked story - neither of which are acceptable grounds on which to make policy. Its just another example of the kind of poorly thought out, back of a fag packet policy making that appeals to Daily Mail readers (see also bin collections and speed limit increases). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mecky Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 100% Get it scrapped. For years before it we managed and any stick that foreign criminals can use to get to live here should be snapped into pieces. As soon as its gone we should start rounding people up and deport the blighters. I should imagine that one or two highly influential neighbouring countries wouldn't be too happy about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElasticMan Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 She didn't help her argument by including the cat reference,and gave he opponents a cheap shot of a response. That said,I certainly believe that all adult immigrants should understand that their residence is conditional on their observance of the laws of this country. This is a convenient sweeping statement and as always the devil is in the detail if such a law can be framed. What level of criminality would incur automatic expulsion.would it be linked to a prison sentence of a certain period. The Burnley case of an illegal immigrant who killed a little girl whilst uninsured and serving a driving ban is a case in point.He got a 4 month sentence having been tried for the technical offences only rather than causing death by dangerous driving.I believe he has previous for minor offences,and successfully resisted deportation because he has fathered children in the uk. Personally I would rather he was kicked out as a useless and dangerous addition to our population but how do you frame the law. I believe that others who have actively plotted against the uk population,and preach hatred against the west are also protected by the human rights issues. There must be a quid pro quo expected from anyone who chooses to live in an adopted country,but it will be interesting to see how this can be legislated,and if it is,how the legislation will be applied. Why do you believe that? Have you got any examples of this happening? I bet you haven't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mj.scuba Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 I agree with Theresa May. There are too many undesirable or unintended outcomes from the application/interpretation of it. If it cannot be rewritten to make it impossible to interpret it in such a way, then scrap it altogether. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSmith Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 RJRB I believe that others who have actively plotted against the uk population,and preach hatred against the west are also protected by the human rights issues. Why do you believe that? Have you got any examples of this happening? I bet you haven't. This is one example. Abu Hamza extradition to US blocked on human rights grounds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 Totally don't agree. If you read what the act covers it is not just about our capacity to deal with criminals and deportees. The act enshrines many basic entitlements that affect our everyday lives. I don't think we should wish that swept away just because it causes Mrs may a few procedural difficulties. In fact the idea of doing so is plain ridiculous. It covers: the right to life freedom from torture and degrading treatment freedom from slavery and forced labour the right to liberty the right to a fair trial the right not to be punished for something that wasn't a crime when you did it the right to respect for private and family life freedom of thought, conscience and religion, and freedom to express your beliefs freedom of expression freedom of assembly and association the right to marry and to start a family the right not to be discriminated against in respect of these rights and freedoms the right to peaceful enjoyment of your property the right to an education the right to participate in free elections the right not to be subjected to the death penalty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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