percy filth Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Many reasons. For example the UK has lax labour laws compared to other countries. Maybe more favourable company law too. It's swings and roundabouts I guess and while taxation is an important facet it isn't the only driver. I'm not sure that labour laws are an incentive to a person wanting to set up a business. I would have thought that was a minus point. But here is the case for our competitor nations in Europe. Nearer the heart of Europe so exports do not need to be taken across seas. Lower wage rates. Lower material costs Lower taxes. Less red tape Flexibility of labour market Shorter shipping routes for importing far eastern goods. (eg to assemble Korean cars) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I'm not sure that labour laws are an incentive to a person wanting to set up a business. I would have thought that was a minus point. But here is the case for our competitor nations in Europe. Nearer the heart of Europe so exports do not need to be taken across seas. Lower wage rates. Lower material costs Lower taxes. Less red tape Flexibility of labour market Shorter shipping routes for importing far eastern goods. (eg to assemble Korean cars) employment law will have an impact. It'll either be favourable or unfavourable. Uk workers do longer hours, have less time off and have less provision for occupation pension than the EU average. That might present an advantage to certain businesses. Like I said swings and roundabouts. It isn't just about the tax regime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
percy filth Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 employment law will have an impact. It'll either be favourable or unfavourable. Uk workers do longer hours, have less time off and have less provision for occupation pension than the EU average. That might present an advantage to certain businesses. Like I said swings and roundabouts. It isn't just about the tax regime. That's all well and good but being average or slighly better doesn't win you the Teddy Bear these days. In the 1980s Japanese car manufacturers picked the UK as their prefered European location to set up car plants. Now the Koreans are picking sites in Eastern Europe because on a balance of tax, employment laws etc etc those countries leave the UK for dead. Increasing taxes isn't about to make the UK look any more attractive to these people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conrod Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Personally I'd quite like to see a flat income tax of 50% and negative income tax/basic income. I don't like seeing people pay a large share of their wages in income tax, and THEN pay 50% of their after tax income in rent for a small home (often smaller than minimum housing standards of the 60s - that are no longer in force, although new ones are being proposed in London). Then pay 7.5% of their after tax income in council tax, then pay 10% of their income on public-private transport (public subsidies and private profits) to get to work, and a further 2.5% in water rates, 10% on fuel and 10% on telecommunications, leaving them only 10% for food. Council tax for a tenant (non property owner) would be 8% of after tax income for a person on £10k. For somebody on £100k it's 1.3%. For a person who owns their own home outright it'd be 8% of after tax income for a person on £10k and 1.3% for someone on £100k. Yet there would be the matter of 50% (for £10k earner) or 10% (For £100k earner) of income spent/not spent on rent. Other taxes have to be considered. Of which there are many. And benefits. Maybe people with higher incomes should pay more for bread and milk too? And more for their fuel? And more for their newspapers? Hell, let's just take 99% of their money off them and give it to the under-achievers who complain they don't get paid enough or their rent is too high Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Many reasons. For example the UK has lax labour laws compared to other countries. Could you elaborate on those laxities and comparisons? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 It's much easier to hire and fire temporary workers in the UK than most of central europe isn't it? We work longer hours (the french do a standard 35hr week don't they)? etc, etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 That's all well and good but being average or slighly better doesn't win you the Teddy Bear these days. In the 1980s Japanese car manufacturers picked the UK as their prefered European location to set up car plants. Now the Koreans are picking sites in Eastern Europe because on a balance of tax, employment laws etc etc those countries leave the UK for dead. Increasing taxes isn't about to make the UK look any more attractive to these people. You're simply describing the process of globalisation, the race for the bottom line. If we want to compete with the Eastern Europeans for Korean car plants then we will have to regress our economy back a number of decades. Jobs at any cost is not a good policy. What do you take out to reduce the cost base? Once you take that something out you might attract some business but it's possibly a one-off win. Some other country will be busy undercutting you for the next batch of business. Decades of progress rolled back just to make Korean cars. No thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Could you elaborate on those laxities and comparisons? See Cyclone's post. I've experienced this first hand in recent years. I worked for an Anglo-French company and staffing cuts were much easier to make in the UK. For example in France making just a handful of workers redundant required a consulatation period. In the UK that didn't kick in until a much higher level, about 30 as I remember it. It was a lot easier for us to make redundancies in the UK than in France. It was cheaper in the UK too - lower payouts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
percy filth Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 You're simply describing the process of globalisation, the race for the bottom line. If we want to compete with the Eastern Europeans for Korean car plants then we will have to regress our economy back a number of decades. Jobs at any cost is not a good policy. What do you take out to reduce the cost base? Once you take that something out you might attract some business but it's possibly a one-off win. Some other country will be busy undercutting you for the next batch of business. Decades of progress rolled back just to make Korean cars. No thanks. Well now that Ford and Rover have completely pulled out of car production in the UK, and the last producer of televisions has also moved production abroad, our steel industry is foreign owned and production is being diverted overseas. The financial institutions are being taxed to the point of shifting to Switzerland, following the lead set by our pharmaceutical industries that started this trend a few years back. I just wonder which industries you would like to see remain in the UK paying ever increasing taxes so that the public sector can retire at 50 on index linked pensions and we can have an expanding NHS that is free to all? I would remind you that there is already annual imbalance between tax revenues and state expenditure of around £150,000,000,000, and this has built up government debts of around £1,200,000,000,000. Where does the cash come from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Well now that Ford and Rover have completely pulled out of car production in the UK, and the last producer of televisions has also moved production abroad, our steel industry is foreign owned and production is being diverted overseas. The financial institutions are being taxed to the point of shifting to Switzerland, following the lead set by our pharmaceutical industries that started this trend a few years back. I just wonder which industries you would like to see remain in the UK paying ever increasing taxes so that the public sector can retire at 50 on index linked pensions and we can have an expanding NHS that is free to all? I would remind you that there is already annual imbalance between tax revenues and state expenditure of around £150,000,000,000, and this has built up government debts of around £1,200,000,000,000. Where does the cash come from? The relianace on the financial sector needs to be broken. That is the first painful restructuring we have to do. Then we have to learn from successful exporters like Germany. Unfortunately it's a case of rebalancing the economy to somewhere like it was before the 80s only with more efficient, more modern industry this time. I didn't say it would be easy but I'd rather we tried to emulate Germany than tried to emulate Romania. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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