Bassman62 Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Since when has that been freedom of speech. You don't seem to understand the difference between freedom of information and free speech. Freedom of speech is being able to say "The Pope's a Nancy" without an RC version of a fatwah being issued whereeas if you'd said a year ago whilst in Trippoli "Gaddaifi is a Nancy" you'd have ended up in jail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman62 Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Germany has already stated they will close all nuclear reactors in 10 years after the Fukushima disaster. Be interesting to see how many they still have in 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXTickerXX Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Be interesting to see how many they still have in 10 years. It will.They have given no clause for revision.....Quote "It's definite: the latest end for the last three nuclear power plants is 2022," Roettgen said after the meeting. "There will be no clause for revision." Some politicians had wanted a clause allowing for the agreement to be revised in future. The FDP had wanted no firm date but rather a flexible window for the exit, plus the option of bringing back at least one of the seven oldest nuclear reactors in case of emergency. The coalition agreed to keep one of the older reactors as a "cold reserve" for 2013, if the transition to renewable energies cannot meet winter demand and if fossil fuels do not suffice to make up for a potential shortfall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman62 Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 It will.They have given no clause for revision.....Quote "It's definite: the latest end for the last three nuclear power plants is 2022," Roettgen said after the meeting. "There will be no clause for revision." Some politicians had wanted a clause allowing for the agreement to be revised in future. The FDP had wanted no firm date but rather a flexible window for the exit, plus the option of bringing back at least one of the seven oldest nuclear reactors in case of emergency. The coalition agreed to keep one of the older reactors as a "cold reserve" for 2013, if the transition to renewable energies cannot meet winter demand and if fossil fuels do not suffice to make up for a potential shortfall. Gullible comes to mind with people who believe what politicians promise until it happens. What we're about on here is the ridding of the world of a despot now regardless of how, why and when. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFKvsNixon Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 I`m not a conspiracy theorist by any stretch but i don`t believe this was done for the good of the people.If that was true they would have done something about north korea long ago.I think the fact that they are allies with the biggest standing army in the world puts them off a bit. I don`t rely on the mainstream media to tell me whats true and not true.I do my own research. For example the biggest nuclear accident ever is still going on in Japan(worse than Chernobyl) yet it has had a near total blackout by the western press.Even as far as a leaked memo by government telling people to suppress it because of the fears of protests and blockades at British nuclear facilities. Since when has that been freedom of speech. Could you qualify your statement that the nuclear accident in Japan was worse than Chernobyl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSmith Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 I`m not a conspiracy theorist by any stretch but i don`t believe this was done for the good of the people.If that was true they would have done something about north korea long ago.I think the fact that they are allies with the biggest standing army in the world puts them off a bit. I don`t rely on the mainstream media to tell me whats true and not true.I do my own research. For example the biggest nuclear accident ever is still going on in Japan(worse than Chernobyl) yet it has had a near total blackout by the western press.Even as far as a leaked memo by government telling people to suppress it because of the fears of protests and blockades at British nuclear facilities. Since when has that been freedom of speech. They didn't black it out very well. Japan faces world's worst nuclear accident since Chernobyl as experts warn fallout may reach U.S. Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1366341/Japan-tsumani-earthquake-America-nuclear-accident-radiation-alert.html#ixzz1boBAnOim Fukushima: As bad as Chernobyl? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-13048916 Why the Fukushima disaster is worse than Chernobyl http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/why-the-fukushima-disaster-is-worse-than-chernobyl-2345542.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balpin Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Kidnapping, torture, rape, incarceration without trial, murder. 42 years of it. Hundreds of thousands of people. Many citizens were vociferously critical, most others were simply disgruntled, it wasn't a good idea to show your disagreement with his regime. Didn't matter to Gaddafi, he saw them all as enemies. From the Physicians for Human Rights report on his war crimes in Misurata: Four eyewitnesses reported that Qaddafi troops forcibly detained 107 civilians and used them as human shields to guard military munitions from NATO attacks south of Misrata. One father told PHR how Qaddafi soldiers forced his two young children to sit on a military tank and threatened, “You’ll stay here, and if NATO attacks us, you’ll die too.” Qaddafi military reportedly shielded weapons in civilian areas including markets, mosques, and schools. PHR inspected four medical facilities and interviewed 21 Libyan medical personnel. One volunteer ambulance driver detailed his own detention and torture, as well as witnessing the summary execution of a civilian. An orthopedic surgeon reported eight separate instances where ambulances marked with the emblematic Red Crescent were attacked while medics tried to reach injured combatants on the front line. Other health workers reported targeted attacks by Qaddafi troops against medical workers, facilities, and civilian patients. Four eyewitnesses reported that Qaddafi forces demolished a home for the elderly and abducted its 36 resident disabled, elderly, and homeless civilians. Their whereabouts remain unknown. Official military orders provided to PHR present strong evidence that Qaddafi ordered his troops to starve civilian residents in Misrata. In addition to pillaging food stores, government forces blocked civilians from receiving humanitarian aid. One witness reported that Qaddafi forces transformed an elementary school into a detention site where they reportedly raped women and girls as young as 14 years old. PHR also documented reports of honor killings that occurred in response to these rapes. A 25-year-old villager recounted how Qaddafi soldiers detained him and other unarmed villagers in a semi-truck trailer, deprived them of food and water, and tortured them for days. That's just a small sample of his recent antics. The full report is here: https://s3.amazonaws.com/PHR_Reports/Libya-WitnesstoWarCrimes-Aug2011.pdf There's an excellent discussion here: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3390388 the thread is currently 477 pages long. Tons of reports from the front lines, historical perspective etc. There are hundreds of links to news items from both sides. Thanks, it goes someway to explaining it. But why have the government only moved now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman62 Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Kidnapping, torture, rape, incarceration without trial, murder. 42 years of it. Hundreds of thousands of people. Many citizens were vociferously critical, most others were simply disgruntled, it wasn't a good idea to show your disagreement with his regime. Didn't matter to Gaddafi, he saw them all as enemies. From the Physicians for Human Rights report on his war crimes in Misurata: Four eyewitnesses reported that Qaddafi troops forcibly detained 107 civilians and used them as human shields to guard military munitions from NATO attacks south of Misrata. One father told PHR how Qaddafi soldiers forced his two young children to sit on a military tank and threatened, “You’ll stay here, and if NATO attacks us, you’ll die too.” Qaddafi military reportedly shielded weapons in civilian areas including markets, mosques, and schools. PHR inspected four medical facilities and interviewed 21 Libyan medical personnel. One volunteer ambulance driver detailed his own detention and torture, as well as witnessing the summary execution of a civilian. An orthopedic surgeon reported eight separate instances where ambulances marked with the emblematic Red Crescent were attacked while medics tried to reach injured combatants on the front line. Other health workers reported targeted attacks by Qaddafi troops against medical workers, facilities, and civilian patients. Four eyewitnesses reported that Qaddafi forces demolished a home for the elderly and abducted its 36 resident disabled, elderly, and homeless civilians. Their whereabouts remain unknown. Official military orders provided to PHR present strong evidence that Qaddafi ordered his troops to starve civilian residents in Misrata. In addition to pillaging food stores, government forces blocked civilians from receiving humanitarian aid. One witness reported that Qaddafi forces transformed an elementary school into a detention site where they reportedly raped women and girls as young as 14 years old. PHR also documented reports of honor killings that occurred in response to these rapes. A 25-year-old villager recounted how Qaddafi soldiers detained him and other unarmed villagers in a semi-truck trailer, deprived them of food and water, and tortured them for days. That's just a small sample of his recent antics. The full report is here: https://s3.amazonaws.com/PHR_Reports/Libya-WitnesstoWarCrimes-Aug2011.pdf There's an excellent discussion here: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3390388 the thread is currently 477 pages long. Tons of reports from the front lines, historical perspective etc. There are hundreds of links to news items from both sides. Quote: Originally Posted by XXTickerXX I`m not a conspiracy theorist by any stretch Maybe you should read the above then hopefuly you'll stop quibling or is it that you've ulterior motives and see Gaddafi as your hero and you're upset that he's met his end? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andygardener Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 Thanks, it goes someway to explaining it. But why have the government only moved now? The government moved when there was a genuine popular revolt, it was about to be violenty crushed and we secured UN support for action to prevent the massacre. Simple really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balpin Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 The government moved when there was a genuine popular revolt, it was about to be violenty crushed and we secured UN support for action to prevent the massacre. Simple really. Ghaddaffi was a wierd one, and I would rather have seen him brought to book. Too many secrets died with him, and it solves nothing. I cannot see Tripoli and Benghazi becoming the next Teneriffe and Benidorm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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