nomme Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 I think your wrong about dowsing. I don't have time to research it at the moment but I'm fairly sure oil and mining companies do employ dowsers as well as geologists in order to find mineral deposits. I have also played around with dowsing with unexplained success. That science cannot explain the phenomenom does not negate the fact that it exists nor can be that it may be utilised. Nomme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
back2basics Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Nomme dowsing is a fake, all scientific research has turned out results WORSE than just common luck. Some police forces have used mediums to track down murders (with little or no success) doesn't make it real. The police officer (or oil company exec.) who brought in these people were probably believers, there are plenty. There have been a few successes, but no more than to suggest luck. It's almost insane to think a man with a stick can find water! But they have been tested and found to be false. Moon then keep us informed how your test goes with James Randi and good luck with the 1 million dollars. Would you buy me a pint when you win for letting you know about it? I have to say many people (including witches) have tried and failed. Quantum Physics does not prove anything about magic, sorry. But it is amazing in it's own right, while some people believe in the flights of fancy, they are missing the truly amazing world of Physics. It's a beautiful think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mosherchik Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Originally posted by Moon Maiden So do the majority of people believe that your future is set or that it is possible to change it? Moon I refuse to believe in destiny...that would mean there would be no point in living...either people are destined to be rich, succesful and powerful or destined to live on the streets in poverty? I hope not! Life is what you make it! Having said that me and some friends did tarot readings on new years eve, but from what I can understand its not predicting the future as such but more giving (very obscure) advice on problems and questions in your life... Mainly we were asking silly questions like "will my car start tomorrow?" but on the more serious ones there were a few coincidences...but as far as Im concerned with the whole future prediction thing...its all guess work, ambiguity and vagueness and if you want to see a magic answer in what fortune tellers have to say then you will see one! xx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
back2basics Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 For Nomme http://www.randi.org/library/dowsing/index.html. Dowsers have tried for the 1 million prize and lost. James just uses a simple double blind test. It's not complicated and doesn't require much of the person to be tested. The person who wants to be tested sets their own rules. So they say what they think they can prove and a double blind test is conceived to test the claim. Nobody has even come close to winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaBouncer Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Originally posted by back2basics Nomme dowsing is a fake Prove it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Maiden Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 You appear to know the fringes of the subjects B2B which is understandable I guess. Dowsing has been used by police officers themselves. There are a number of documented cases that occured during WWII in order to help find the bodies under the rubble. None of this of course will make it real or fake, it gives light to a possibility. Which is what I said about Quantum, which give us the possibility of magiks existence. Tell me have you read about Chaos theory? Moon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
back2basics Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Moon there are literally millions of scientific tests (not anecdotal) that prove downswing to be false. So do you believe 100 or literally millions of test all over the world? Yeah i am very well versed with both Chaos theory and String Theory. Neither of them have anything to do with magic, but are fantastic theories in their own right. Also chaos theory is not even quantum physics strictly. They do overlap a little (as do all sciences) but it's not actually Quantum physics. But i would be glad to here why you think it opens the possibility of magic. But i must say magic does exist, i can myself make the card you pick raise from a pack without even touching the pack. But anybody could do it, and there is nothing supernatural about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Maiden Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Like I said you are simply on the fringes of the subject - when I said chaos theory I meant chaos magik. As for the card - you do better than I because that isn't the magik I talk about and is why I spell it differently to differentiate. Yes I would believe the 100's of tests - but also in that I cannot completely discount the things I have seen and experienced myself. Also the stories I quote for dowsing are actual police records as opposed to 'my mate said his grandad did this in WWII'. Which although are not conducted in the scienfitic lab, are certainly not to be written off completely. Science would not exist if it was not for the superstitions of times past and the desire by mankind to explain them. Today's magik is tomorrows science and again I don't speak of paul daniels or that damned man Kevin Carlyron either. With regard to quantum - my knowledge of this is slight and I have friends who are better versed in this than I. But I said nothing about the physics but of the theory. One thing I believe is taken from the theory is that of parralel universes. This gives an wonderful explaination for magik - that you take an event from a parralel universe that is more desireable than the current and swop them round. Of course it does throw into the spotlight on how you would go about such a task. However is parralel universes are possible then to move them about or merge them for a moment would certainly be possible. The parralel comes into play also for mediums - that they tap into a person who has not yet passed over who is still living on a paralel universe. This person is able to tell the medium everything about the 'spirit' they believe they have contacted, except a few incidents that are not right. Personally I do not set out in my day to day to remove other peoples beliefs because I think they are damaging or harmful. I have very strong opinions on a number of belief structures, however I also appreciate that these beliefs are what get people through the day on some occasions. I also accept that man will reuqire the belief in something regardless, be that god, magik or science. Moon Maiden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dug Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Are you trying to tell me that Father Christmas and the Tooth Fairy are not real? Come on they must be, otherwise how do all the presents get delivered? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Maiden Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Randi does it - with his collection of professors in white coats Moon Maiden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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