A poll on attitudes to pornography

[Suffragette1]

I agree entirely with this sentiment. The impression certain types of porn gives young males and females regarding what the female body looks like is very worrying. This especially applies to the vulva; there are too many young girls who think there's something wrong with their vulva because their labia are long and they think this is somehow abnormal. And unfortunately there are surgeons who are only too willing to make money from these girls' insecurities.

 

Let's not forget men aswell. They're also given unrealistic representations of what the average penis size is and that can also have a damaging effect on a young lad who doesn't know any better. There was a programme repeated on TV not long ago looking into this issue (called My Penis and Everyone Else's), and at the end of the documentary they set up a gallery of maybe a 100 or so photographs of penises (just men from the general public) and it was really positive. It got the exhibition goers discussing their own genitals and gain a bit of perspective. A documentary well worth watching for both men and women; it's on vimeo.

 

In a similar vein, and doing something for women's anxieties, sculptor Jamie McCartney created an exhibition of plaster casts of 400 vulvas taken from volunteers which was displayed in Brighton. Unfortunately it's gone now, but anything which gives a real representation of what genitals actually look like, and the many variations, can only be a positive thing.

 

The key here is education, which should start at home. I think it's the parents' job to give their child the bulk of their sex education (or at least some of it), but I don't think this happens enough due to the parents' embarrassment more than anything. If it was talked about openly from a young age this embarrassment wouldn't exist and when the child got to the age of engaging in sexual relationships, they'd know how to do it properly, safely and with respect. It would also help them to understand that porn, and the bodies seen in some porn, does not reflect reality.

 

 

I'd like to pick up on the bold part in particular. Purely in terms of mutual pleasure, the sex shown in Hollywood films and the majority of tv shows is stupid really. It's mainly based on penetrative sex only - how often do we see (or even have implied) female oral or manual sex in a Hollywood film? Sure there are some instances, but it seems this is somehow deemed more offensive?

 

(Bravo to Misfits on that score. Female oral sex, male oral sex and even mutual masturbation represented. )

 

 

 

 

I remember that too Halibut; Channel 4 have proved pretty good in terms of sex education programmes. They also had one called The Sex Clinic (I think?) which looked at everything, from body insecurities, to masturbation, to sex toys etc., which was also very positive.

 

Totally agree with all of the above. I think that there is however, generally more of a received wisdom that Hollywood sex bears no resemblance to reality, unlike porn. A friend of mine did some voluntary work for one of the AIDS charities back in the '90s and they had to do a group workshop on what was unrealistic about Hollywood sex scenes. Someone replied 'there are no clothes marks' which I thought was hilarious. On a serious note, the only realistic thing about porn as far as I can make out is the time that it takes for a man to ejaculate, as even the most hardened porn viewer (no pun intended) would find it a bit tedious to watch a man and woman having penetrative sex whilst she squealed her head off like a stuck pig for the duration of an hour, say, for it to finally culminate in the 'money shot'

 

Oral and manual sex scenes are generally, as Bulgarian points out, regarded as seedy and usually reserved for storylines involving prostitutes proving a bit of hand or oral relief.

 

I watched a Channel 4 documentary on labiaplasty a few years ago and saw that exhibition. The programme sickened me however, here were these young girls prepared to mutilate themselves to model themselves on porn stars whose genitals are nipped, tucked, bleached and shaved within an inch of their life in order to maximise the visual penetration shots.

 

Regrettably, I don't think that that many parents do sit down and try and discuss sex openly with their kids. We have in the past, however, my son is now 13 and I have tried to talk to him in recent times but he is mortified beyond belief now listening to his mum wax lyrical about sex and discuss the negative aspects of pornography. Schools need to play a role and perhaps a mentor system within schools would be a good idea where a pupil (or student as they're now called) could approach someone in confidence. The problem with sex education in schools is that the kids whose parents are least likely to even attempt an open dialogue about sex with their children are the very same ones who withhold consent for their kids to attend the classes. So where do they go to get their information? On the internet and what comes up when you google 'sex'? Porn sites.

Then there's all this moaning and groaning and women having an "orgasm." I never knew such a thing as a female orgasm existed, I've never experienced a woman having an orgasm anyway..

 

We're so selfish us women.

 

I think people think oral/manual is a bit "seedy" and there is the feeling that ony one person is getting off on it, also it's not romantic stuff that people in love do.

 

Personally I'm all for both, you don't have to get fully undressed to do them, so theya re ideal for a "quicky"

 

As above.

[Frank Sidney]

I can't quite get the DP scenario either. I can't see that being much fun for the woman, does that sort of thing go on in real life? I don't think I'd like to participate, the thought of another man's onions banging against me would ensure the DP became a SP rapidly..

[Cyclone]

I agree entirely with this sentiment. The impression certain types of porn gives young males and females regarding what the female body looks like is very worrying. This especially applies to the vulva; there are too many young girls who think there's something wrong with their vulva because their labia are long and they think this is somehow abnormal. And unfortunately there are surgeons who are only too willing to make money from these girls' insecurities.

 

Let's not forget men aswell. They're also given unrealistic representations of what the average penis size is and that can also have a damaging effect on a young lad who doesn't know any better. There was a programme repeated on TV not long ago looking into this issue (called My Penis and Everyone Else's), and at the end of the documentary they set up a gallery of maybe a 100 or so photographs of penises (just men from the general public) and it was really positive. It got the exhibition goers discussing their own genitals and gain a bit of perspective. A documentary well worth watching for both men and women; it's on vimeo.

 

In a similar vein, and doing something for women's anxieties, sculptor Jamie McCartney created an exhibition of plaster casts of 400 vulvas taken from volunteers which was displayed in Brighton. Unfortunately it's gone now, but anything which gives a real representation of what genitals actually look like, and the many variations, can only be a positive thing.

 

The key here is education, which should start at home. I think it's the parents' job to give their child the bulk of their sex education (or at least some of it), but I don't think this happens enough due to the parents' embarrassment more than anything. If it was talked about openly from a young age this embarrassment wouldn't exist and when the child got to the age of engaging in sexual relationships, they'd know how to do it properly, safely and with respect. It would also help them to understand that porn, and the bodies seen in some porn, does not reflect reality.

 

 

I'd like to pick up on the bold part in particular. Purely in terms of mutual pleasure, the sex shown in Hollywood films and the majority of tv shows is stupid really. It's mainly based on penetrative sex only - how often do we see (or even have implied) female oral or manual sex in a Hollywood film? Sure there are some instances, but it seems this is somehow deemed more offensive?

 

(Bravo to Misfits on that score. Female oral sex, male oral sex and even mutual masturbation represented. )

 

 

 

 

I remember that too Halibut; Channel 4 have proved pretty good in terms of sex education programmes. They also had one called The Sex Clinic (I think?) which looked at everything, from body insecurities, to masturbation, to sex toys etc., which was also very positive.

 

Oral sex is a problem for hollywood since they generally show only hetrosexual intercourse and are banned by law in most countries from showing an erect penis...

[JenC]

I can't quite get the DP scenario either. I can't see that being much fun for the woman, does that sort of thing go on in real life? I don't think I'd like to participate, the thought of another man's onions banging against me would ensure the DP became a SP rapidly..

 

I'd imagine a lot of the things done in certain types of porn aren't much fun for the woman. Like I said at the beginning of the thread, I think some of it should be labelled male domination pornography.

 

As for if DP (just DP, vaginal DP or anal DP?) happens in real life, I couldn't say what people get up to behind closed doors. Normal DP doesn't need to be done with two men (man and toy, or indeed, no man at all if desired ) and can be fun. I don't think I wish to know what the other two are like to be honest. But hey, it depends what you're into. I wouldn't judge anyone for what they want to do, providing everyone involved is safe and consenting. And it goes without saying that no one should ever be forced to or made to feel like they have to do something they don't want to do.

 

(Mods I apologise if this crosses the boundries into not family friendly. I'm hoping kids won't know what DP means).

 

edited to add: I once read a quote on a blog where an adult film actor said the question he was most asked was, "How do I have sex like a porn star?", his answer? "Don't".

[Jessica23]

I'd imagine a lot of the things done in certain types of porn aren't much fun for the woman. Like I said at the beginning of the thread, I think some of it should be labelled male domination pornography.

 

I'd assume - if the porn in question came from a reputable source, which of course is not always the case - that heterosexual male-dominant porn is, equally and just as validly, heterosexual female-submissive porn, which plenty of women do enjoy, in and out of the porn scene.

 

It may not look like much fun if it's not your thing, but there's no reason why it couldn't or shouldn't be fun for the woman involved.

[Jessica23]

I can't quite get the DP scenario either. I can't see that being much fun for the woman, does that sort of thing go on in real life? I don't think I'd like to participate, the thought of another man's onions banging against me would ensure the DP became a SP rapidly..

 

It certainly does go on in real life, and (again) there are plenty of women who enjoy it.

 

I wonder how much of the assumptions that are made about what women may and may not enjoy are tied into various notions of gender-appropriate behaviour. That is - women are not expected to like rough or violent sex because women are not expected to be rough or violent in life, that's a masculine stereotype; women are not expected to enjoy 'dirty' or 'degrading' things (insert your own examples here) because women are expected to err on the side of being high-minded and romantic about sex, etc.

 

It's just as pernicious for a woman to have the message thrown at her constantly that the things she enjoys are actually degrading and harmful to women as it is to assume that a woman should do things that she's not comfortable with, for whatever reason.

[Jessica23]

Oral sex is a problem for hollywood since they generally show only hetrosexual intercourse and are banned by law in most countries from showing an erect penis...

 

And which is therefore not a problem in showing oral sex with a female recipient.

 

I think JenC's original point was absolutely spot on - penetrative sex is often presented as the Key to All Sex in Hollywood, when the research suggests that a majority of women do not orgasm through penetration. Or not solely through penetration. Therefore the representation is skewed - and I'd argue that this isn't because oral or manual sex is more offensive, or more seedy.

 

I think it's more likely to be because Hollywood does love its stereotypes and its cliches and its putting of women into the box marked ONLY USEFUL AROUND A MAN. Or in this instance, around a penis.

[Suffragette1]

I'd assume - if the porn in question came from a reputable source, which of course is not always the case - that heterosexual male-dominant porn is, equally and just as validly, heterosexual female-submissive porn, which plenty of women do enjoy, in and out of the porn scene.

 

It may not look like much fun if it's not your thing, but there's no reason why it couldn't or shouldn't be fun for the woman involved.

 

It certainly does go on in real life, and (again) there are plenty of women who enjoy it.

 

I wonder how much of the assumptions that are made about what women may and may not enjoy are tied into various notions of gender-appropriate behaviour. That is - women are not expected to like rough or violent sex because women are not expected to be rough or violent in life, that's a masculine stereotype; women are not expected to enjoy 'dirty' or 'degrading' things (insert your own examples here) because women are expected to err on the side of being high-minded and romantic about sex, etc.

 

It's just as pernicious for a woman to have the message thrown at her constantly that the things she enjoys are actually degrading and harmful to women as it is to assume that a woman should do things that she's not comfortable with, for whatever reason.

 

This is a very tricky area fraught with danger, I feel. There are so many myths and stereotypical views around female sexuality which lead to all kinds of problems in the sexual arena, not least this notion that women somehow have to be romanced/seduced/'wooed' into sex or somehow coaxed and cajoled when there has been flirtation beforehand but she does not wish to take it further. The number of men who believe that a woman has consented to sex when she perceives that she has been raped, in reported cases, is disturbing.

[Jessica23]

This is a very tricky area fraught with danger, I feel. There are so many myths and stereotypical views around female sexuality which lead to all kinds of problems in the sexual arena, not least this notion that women somehow have to be romanced/seduced/'wooed' into sex or somehow coaxed and cajoled when there has been flirtation beforehand but she does not wish to take it further. The number of men who believe that a woman has consented to sex when she perceives that she has been raped, in reported cases, is disturbing.

 

It's only tricky in cases where people aren't communicating properly. There is zero excuse for not getting full verbal consent for everything, especially if you want to veer towards the kinky end of the spectrum. Safe, sane and consensual is the unofficial code of practice there.

 

I completely agree about the damaging myths and so on. But to put it bluntly, no one should ever have to be cajoled into sex. People who are really into the idea and want to do it don't need to be. Ever.

[Suffragette1]

It's only tricky in cases where people aren't communicating properly. There is zero excuse for not getting full verbal consent for everything, especially if you want to veer towards the kinky end of the spectrum. Safe, sane and consensual is the unofficial code of practice there.

 

I completely agree about the damaging myths and so on. But to put it bluntly, no one should ever have to be cajoled into sex. People who are really into the idea and want to do it don't need to be. Ever.

 

I agree, however, too many people make too many assumptions based on the gender stereotypes and couples (casual/new and established) tend not to discuss a lot of these issues up front. I think that women, up until a generation or two ago, felt that if they appeared too keen at the outset to indulge in pre-marital sex, the man in question would consider her to be some kind of 'slag', so some kind of faux protest was expected of them.