MrSmith Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Why? We have put nearly zero effort in to making unpleasant jobs fun. Instead we have forced people to do them under threat of starvation. We could as a potential solution share out that unpleasant work equally. Better still keep some aspects of the reward structure in place. An upper and lower limit on wealth with a substantial range in between. The premise of your arguments against a more egalitarian society is that there is no incentive to work. So keep some incentives and limit the extremes. That is how you would transition from one to the other. People who might want to better themselves. Haven't you ever seen Star-Trek? Why? because it’s human nature to be different and you want a society where everyone wants and is content with the same. I could never imagine a society in which a road sweeper does a job share with a brain surgeon, and I don’t think it would be possible to make mining fun, or cleaning toilets fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truman Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 No a lot of people actually go into jobs they love and never make 'their cash'. Lots of example of that. Others earn highly and downsize later. I wouldn't deny either that others ditch the jobs they love and go after the money The point is you can't say everybody is out to maximise their income. They aren't. For example I'm good friends with a hospital consultant and he chooses not to do private practice just NHS work - if he did private work too he could dramatically enhance his income. In my own household we earn about 50% of what we could - wife does only one day a week so she can be there more for our young kids and I've turned down much higher paid jobs in other cities. I have a friend who is an orthopaedic surgeon who also only does NHS work..for which he is very well paid...would he do it if he was paid the same as a roadsweeper..probably not ..my point is not that people want to always maximise their salary but want a decent differential... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ultimatesens Posted December 23, 2011 Author Share Posted December 23, 2011 So why don't more people volunteer rather than complain on here about how little they are paid? Because the products of their labor are stolen and they are denied access to the basic necessities of life while the thieves have those necessities millions of times over. To many people volunteering seems futile and finding food and paying the mortgage takes up all of their time. If people want to volunteer they should start by going down to the local millionaires mansion or yacht club with placards saying "We all hate you." When enough people start to do that they will get the message and start to behave responsibly. In the long run that will have much more success than Oxfam or Greenpeace ever could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 I have a friend who is an orthopaedic surgeon who also only does NHS work..for which he is very well paid...would he do it if he was paid the same as a roadsweeper..probably not ..my point is not that people want to always maximise their salary but want a decent differential... I would never expect him to be paid the same as a roadsweeper. But as you say he could earn a lot more than he does now, but doesn't probably because he can still achieve a perfectly acceptable lifestyle even without maximising income. You're just backing up my point that not everybody is motivated by earning the most money possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSmith Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Because the products of their labor are stolen and they are denied access to the basic necessities of life while the thieves have those necessities millions of times over. To many people volunteering seems futile and finding food and paying the mortgage takes up all of their time. If people want to volunteer they should start by going down to the local millionaires mansion or yacht club with placards saying "We all hate you." When enough people start to do that they will get the message and start to behave responsibly. In the long run that will have much more success than Oxfam or Greenpeace ever could. Your motivation for wanting an equal society is defiantly envy as demonstrated by your hatred of people with more than you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truman Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 I would never expect him to be paid the same as a roadsweeper. But as you say he could earn a lot more than he does now, but doesn't probably because he can still achieve a perfectly acceptable lifestyle even without maximising income. You're just backing up my point that not everybody is motivated by earning the most money possible. Did I say people want to earn the most money possible?I was really talking with Cavegirl who appears to want everyone to be paid the same.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 The motivation to work isn't money. It's the things money buys. As long as we need to do some work to keep getting those things then there's an incentive. In our society you need money to buy things. I don't see any radical change to that model. People paid in kind (e.g. with a basic house and basic food) have an incentive but not a great one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSmith Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 I would never expect him to be paid the same as a roadsweeper. But as you say he could earn a lot more than he does now, but doesn't probably because he can still achieve a perfectly acceptable lifestyle even without maximising income. You're just backing up my point that not everybody is motivated by earning the most money possible. I don't think anyone as argued differently, I'm not motivated by greed, I could easily earn more than I do but I choose not to, but not everyone is the same and why should someone that wants more be prevented from achieving their goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Did I say people want to earn the most money possible?I was really talking with Cavegirl who appears to want everyone to be paid the same.. Well we all know that will never work. Idealistic societies that start out with social levelling policies eventually end up abandoning them, sometimes quite quickly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ultimatesens Posted December 23, 2011 Author Share Posted December 23, 2011 In the society we have now people can help others if they wish or can become wealthy and spend cash on commodities if they wish. I've wished for that all my life and it still hasn't happened. Your "society" is obviously very different to mine and many other people's. That sounds like a fare society to me, people having the choice to do what they want within the law. It would be if it were true. As it stands today people are forced to do things they hate just to make ends meat for themselves while turning over most of the real profit they have generated to the few greedy selfish people at the top. Those people at the top also have an uncanny knack of disregarding or even re-writing the law whenever it suits them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.