Would you ever consider becoming a 'Traveller'?

[Harleyman]

Trailers for sale or rent,

Rooms to let 50 cents.

No phone no pool no pets

Aint got no cigarettes

I smoke old stogies I have found

short but not too big or round

I'm a man of means but no means

King of the road !!!!!

[Cavegirl]

Unfortunately, they don't (in many cases) 'operate as a separate society from UK society.' - They might not wish to live in UK society, but they have no objections to relying on UK society to fund their lifestyle.

 

I've no objection to living in different places. - I've moved so often that it seems strange to me to be in any one place for an extended period.

 

There is a considerable number of people in the US who spend much of their lives travelling. - Mainly retired people, but also many with jobs which they can do 'on the road'. 'Snowbirds' aren't all retired people.

 

I like where I'm living at the moment - it's 10:30, the sky is blue, the sun is shining, it's 21'C. The opportunities for sailing, fishing, swimming or just laying on the beach are there .... and I'll be going at least one of those things in a couple of hours time.

 

There aren't any mountains here. (The nearest thing to a 'mountain' is a fire ant nest - and you don't want to climb one of those. ) The scenery isn't particularly spectacular (apart from on the beach) and the roads are boring.

 

In summer, I will live in the mountains. - Stunning scenery, 'interesting' roads and good hiking.

 

I'm surprised you feel that travelling and living in campsites is cheap. (Though housing is expensive and rents are high.) I suppose it depends on where and when you camp, how much the campsite is costs you, how much actual travelling you are going to do and what you are prepared to accept for accommodation.

 

I considered seriously buying a caravan (or a mobile home) and living in it during the summer. I wouldn't want to live in a 15ft caravan for 5 or 6 months - that would soon seem a bit cramped. A large well-insulated, well-equipped caravan isn't cheap and my wife's car wouldn't be able to tow one, so I would need to buy a towing vehicle. The outlay would've been fairly high.

 

I looked at powered campers. Again, not cheap to buy, require maintenance and the resale value (if I bought new) would be considerably lower than the purchase price. There are second-hand campers available, but they're not cheap, either.

 

Then I considered the fuel costs. Fuel is rather cheaper here than it is in the UK, but it's still a significant expense. Not only would I need road fuel, but I would also need fuel for air conditioning/heating and electricity generation.

 

Then I looked at campsite costs. Even with state park season passes (about £130) campsites cost in the region of £15-£25 a night for a 'developed' site (with mains power, water, washing facilities/lavatories and a launderette.)

 

My 'rent' - the cost of occupying the campsite - was going to work out at somewhere in the region of £3500 - £4000 for 5 months. (That would, admittedly, have included the cost of electricity and water) but when I added in the travel costs, cost of the camper, costs of maintenance and depreciation, it no longer seemed like a cheap option, unfortunately.

 

On your first point I would argue that you're mixing up society with economy, I would argue that whilst they're part of our economy (they don't use a seperate form of currency and they do work in various capacities within our economy) they do have a seperate society with different cultural and religious values to the rest of the UK and an unwillingness to assimilate those values with ours.

 

On your second point I would point out that I said 'far cheaper' not 'cheaply' in my original point. If you were to be a full time wwoofer for example, the only money you would need to raise would be fuel, tax and insurance costs and basic necessities. This can still add up to a fair sum, but nothing like the amount if you had to pay rent alongside car and necessity costs. Let's face it, when you buy/ rent a house there is a great compulsion to then fill it with 'stuff'- a compulsion that is greatly hindered in a smaller caravan. Campsite to campsite living would be far more expensive (about £110 per week in site costs plus motoring costs and necessities) but it's still much cheaper than many Sheffield combined rental and energy prices.

[SiSiSi]

Im sorry, did I miss something.

 

Who exactly are all these out of work people who are suddenly living in squalor. Have we suddenly developed a load of mass shanty town on the outskirts of the city? Are all these people living in a ditch drinking water from the drains???

 

Get a grip

 

No, they are living in Gleadless Valley.

[Rupert_Baehr]

I agree that travellers have different cultural (and sometimes religious - I'm not aware that they are all adherents to one religion) - values to the rest of the UK, but then again, in Sheffield there are many groups with both different cultural and religious values who are also unwilling to assimilate with your values. They may live in separate communities, but they are not permitted to 'opt out' of the responsibility for paying their share into the taxation system.

 

Cultural segregation is a separate subject.

 

Travellers do - as is obvious from their name - prefer to lead a somewhat nomadic existence. I can certainly empathise with that! A number of my friends/acquaintances have said to me: "You move around a lot, how do you put down roots?" - The answer is "You don't." If you move often, you tend not to see family members very often - that is a downside - but we probably have as many (or rather as few) real friends as do other people, though we may not see those friends as often. Now that we are both retired, we won't move around as much as we used to - indeed, we will probably move from one fixed home to another fixed home.

 

Wwoofing - as on organic farms - may be relatively new, but the UK has a long tradition of migrant agricultural workers who went where the crops/jobs were. If it suits you - go for it.

 

If you can get a pitch on a campsite (a developed site with utilities included) for about £110 a week, then IMO, you're getting a very good deal. I don't think that comparing a 15ft caravan (about 100sq ft of living accommodation?) with a house is an accurate comparison.

 

How much would it cost to rent an unfurnished 10'x10' room in Sheffield? I could rent a small apartment (1 bedroom, living room, kitchen and bathroom) for €400 [£323] a month, including property taxes (which are very low) right next door to my house in Bavaria. An additional £50 a month would cover gas, water, electricity and rubbish collection.

[Green Web]

Is it actually possible to live in a motor vehicle? Whats the law on just pulling somewhere and sleeping in your vehicle?

 

Would you ever have to pay CT?

 

Would you need a PO box, letter drop somewhere, registering to vote, doctors etc?

[Cavegirl]

Is it actually possible to live in a motor vehicle? Whats the law on just pulling somewhere and sleeping in your vehicle?

 

Would you ever have to pay CT?

 

Would you need a PO box, letter drop somewhere, registering to vote, doctors etc?

 

In terms of legalities you're not allowed to pull up and park overnight on English and Welsh roads, but it is legal to do so in Scotland.

 

You don't have to pay Council tax, but if you're on a camp site the cost of this is included in the site fee.

 

A PO Box could be a useful thing to have, but isn't compulsory.

 

Not sure about voting, I guess you could use a parents/ friends address if you were inclined to do it.

 

You'd have to either register with a doctor and travel to them when you needed them or you can use a walk-in centre anywhere in the country.

 

This is a link to a couples blog which describes how they manage to live full time in their caravan:

http://ourlifeinacaravan.blogspot.com/

[Rupert_Baehr]

Is it actually possible to live in a motor vehicle? Whats the law on just pulling somewhere and sleeping in your vehicle?

 

Would you ever have to pay CT?

 

Would you need a PO box, letter drop somewhere, registering to vote, doctors etc?

 

It varies from place to place. Shortly after I arrived in Bavaria, a group of travellers pulled up by the village green and started to set up camp. The police arrived about 3 minutes later and told them they couldn't camp there.

 

"But we're travellers! We have a right to camp!"

 

"Yes you do - but not on the village green. We will accompany you to a campsite and we will make sure you are treated exactly like everybody else. You won't have to pay one Euro more than anybody else does, either. Our assistance doesn't end there. If you intend to stay here for an extended period, we take you to the Town Hall and to the Foreign residents office, so that you can register and get a tax number."

 

For some strange reason, they declined the free assistance and left.

 

Some lay-bys/rest areas in Germany (and in the US too) permit overnight stops - others do not. I don't think any allow long-term stops. Presumably council taxes are included in the fee for camping on approved sites. (I doubt that there are many local authorities in the UK who would let a campsite operator get away without paying property taxes. )

 

Registering with a doctor is difficult if you move around - but not impossible - and emergency treatment is available at no cost to anybody in the US, in Germany and in the UK.

 

If you've been on a UK Electoral Register within the last 15 years (or if you were under 18 when you left the UK and left within the last 15 years) and you do not live in the UK, you can register to vote, so presumably if you do live in the UK and are of 'no fixed abode' the same would apply to you.