Ed Balls in U-turn over cuts

[LeMaquis]

Why are you saing this, what do you hope to achieve by making such posts?

 

I think it's called dealing with reality, not something the average Labour Party member is any good at.

[Balpin]

Are you sure about that? My understand is that the demand was fuelled by cheap credit, government and personal debts are now too high, so demand as dropped because people and governments have lost the ability to pay.

 

What has fundamentaly changed in the world?

Nothing.

A few outstanding mortgages, even to the tune of billions are nothing.

This all a con, and you are falling for it.

Fuel is at rock bottom ,and we are still paying top dollar for it.

But keep listening to Dave, he will set you right.

Fools.

[Cyclone]

What has fundamentaly changed in the world?

Nothing.

A few outstanding mortgages, even to the tune of billions are nothing.

This all a con, and you are falling for it.

Fuel is at rock bottom ,and we are still paying top dollar for it.

But keep listening to Dave, he will set you right.

Fools.

 

It's all just a global conspiracy the sole purpose of which is to keep the working man poor? Even as crackpot conspiracies go that makes very little sense. Poor people don't spend money and buy consumer goods.

A thriving economy is better for the rich than a failing one, nobody gains in this imaginary conspiracy.

Credit dried up practically over night, house prices stopped climbing, people panicked and stopped spending, companies stopped making money, a recession was born. Money market interest rates increased dramatically, government revenue from tax fell, interest payments went up, they realised that they had to cut spending and really should have saved something in the previous boom period but hadn't, that's what they're dealing with now.

[Balpin]

It's all just a global conspiracy the sole purpose of which is to keep the working man poor? Even as crackpot conspiracies go that makes very little sense. Poor people don't spend money and buy consumer goods.

A thriving economy is better for the rich than a failing one, nobody gains in this imaginary conspiracy.

Credit dried up practically over night, house prices stopped climbing, people panicked and stopped spending, companies stopped making money, a recession was born. Money market interest rates increased dramatically, government revenue from tax fell, interest payments went up, they realised that they had to cut spending and really should have saved something in the previous boom period but hadn't, that's what they're dealing with now.

 

In other words, your beloved capitalism failed, never to recover?

Welcome the dictorial caliphate, and the stone age.

[Cyclone]

Nope, not at all. It goes through troughs as bubbles correct and attitudes change, but it corrects itself and carries on.

 

Why do you think it's my beloved capitalism though, I was just explaining what happened, I didn't invent the system.

[purdy]

So now Labour have conceded that the cuts were necessary as were the pay freezes. There doesn't seem a lot of differences between the policy of the main partys anymore.

It all boils down to who you trust to administer the cuts. Those who ran the ship into the reef and spent 2 years denying it had hit, or those who turned up with the life boats with a plan to save the passengers.

[wednesday1]

So now Labour have conceded that the cuts were necessary as were the pay freezes. There doesn't seem a lot of differences between the policy of the main partys anymore.

It all boils down to who you trust to administer the cuts. Those who ran the ship into the reef and spent 2 years denying it had hit, or those who turned up with the life boats with a plan to save the passengers.

 

 

 

They seem to be saying that because the economy is heading back into recession due to the ConDems massive cuts the economy will be to weak to support greater public spending after the next election.

[retrogo]

This caning of the so called public sector is not new, it has been going on for years.

People in the public sector are the most poorly paid of all workers.

They are the whipping boy at all times.

Yet they do the most necessary, and important, work.

Nearly all private sector work can be done without, for a period.

 

But public sector work is essential, it must be done, at all times.

That is why the government organise it.

 

As was vividly shown in the 'winter of discontent' public sector workers are the most important people in the land.

 

 

You cant do that, have an opinion slightly to the left. You'l get crusified by the millionare conservatives on the SF.

 

Though its a slightly miss-informed opinion with a few home truths included:

 

Pay and conditions are generally quit reasonable in the public sector. The people who tend to be the best paid tend to be managerment grade or people in professional posts such as social sorkers, doctors etv. Locally though, most council workers in semi skilled positions are on an average of about 16k if you remove the management grades in that figure. Its not a brilliant wage, but much better that most in Sheffield.

 

The public sector is often not an easy profession. Like you said, many of them do jobs and deal with customers that others would not do. The users of such services tend to have high expectations beyond the scope of the services so they are unhappy, then the rest of the population look on in jealousy of others that use these services (A typical view is "we pay our taxes and can't get nothing, yet people who don't get everything off the state"). It just ends up being one viscious circle of complaining customers and a negative public opinon. So public sector workers have to put up with negative opinions of the hard work they do from all corners of the general public.

A lot of public sector work is essential such as social services, housing, NHS, education. The kind of things you can't cut without having negative long term effects. Haveing an uneducated and unhealth workforce of the future will not benefit the country. Though governments and councils from all parties have wasted money on non essential things.

 

I'm afraid the public sector can't do without the private sector. The public sector doesn't generate an income. If it did, it would be uneffical as their prime function is to support the most needy in society who you can't make a profit out of. Many of the right wingers on here will quite rightly tell you that public sector saleries are funded by the private sector.

 

No government or council services can exist, no matter how essential without enough workers paying taxes.

 

One bugbare I do have is governments and councils givingTaxpayers money to top up the share dividens of private companies. EG some councils use outsourced companies to manage their housing and council tax benefits. If they just ran the public department as effeciently as a private company, the would be profits would be money kept in a councils budget.

 

The way the unions behaved in the lat 60s and 70s gave the working person a bad name. If you worked for an organisation that provided utilities or sanitation, do you think the general public would support your actions when feeling cold living in streets filled with rubbish. All the unions did was shoot themselves in the foot for when Maggy cam along and took them on.

[Balpin]

The way the unions behaved in the lat 60s and 70s gave the working person a bad name. If you worked for an organisation that provided utilities or sanitation, do you think the general public would support your actions when feeling cold living in streets filled with rubbish. All the unions did was shoot themselves in the foot for when Maggy cam along and took them on.

 

Just to take your final paragraph.

I well remember the so called winter of discontent, and many more before it.

In what way did we shoot ourselves in the foot?

 

It was the voters who shot themselves by voting in the most obscene government this country has had under that vile creature Thatcher.

 

We on the contrary showed how important public sector work is.

[Riannon]

 

It was the voters who shot themselves by voting in the most obscene government this country has had under that vile creature Thatcher.

 

.

 

But having done that the voters voted it in again and again and again. It seemed that the population as a whole wanted that government and it was just a minority including yourself that didn't.