MrSmith Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I I'll always remember a discussion I had with one of their friends in church discussing my atheism; I said if I was wrong and there is a god I believe that he would have recognised that I'd lived a good life and I'd go to heaven, to which I had the curt reply that this assumption was wrong. Without the worship heaven would be closed to me. Although it didn't upset me in the slightest, it's something that I find baffling, maybe as an atheist it's something that I'll never get. It is a bit of a flaw in their religion, a repentant Christian bad person can go to heaven but a good atheist can’t, it is written in such a way as to control what people do and think, if a god existed I doubt it would do that, only a man would do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danot Posted January 22, 2012 Author Share Posted January 22, 2012 When have I claimed to know what the universe is or isn't ? Have I been sleep- claiming again? You appear to be quite confused about who has said what.. Not really. Besides, I wasn't saying that you had claimed that you know what the universe is or isn't, I was referring to the unknown phenomena which you and numerous other atheists have claimed isn't responsible for creating the universe. I am correct in thinking that your position hasn't changed and still is that there is no reason to invoke creationism to explain why the universe exists or to assume that the unknown phenomena is responsible for it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danot Posted January 22, 2012 Author Share Posted January 22, 2012 I did'nt mention anything about contradictions. It was a hasty comment but was not meant to be rude.I was merely referring to your continual amount of postings in consequence,and thought a break would be of benifit. In retrospect i see that you were responding to the comments of other posters and showing good manners by replying to them. I realise it was not really my business to pass comment on that matter and i apologise. No worries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSmith Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Not really. Besides, I wasn't saying that you had claimed that you know what the universe is or isn't, I was referring to the unknown phenomena which you and numerous other atheists have claimed isn't responsible for creating the universe. I am correct in thinking that your position hasn't changed and still is that there is no reason to invoke creationism to explain why the universe exists or to assume that the unknown phenomena is responsible for it? I thought it was you using the unknown phenomena idea for the creation of the universe. As an atheist I certainly don't subscribe to that idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 When have I claimed to know what the universe is or isn't ? Have I been sleep- claiming again? You appear to be quite confused about who has said what. Not really. Besides, I wasn't saying that you had claimed that you know what the universe is or isn't, I was referring to the unknown phenomena which you and numerous other atheists have claimed isn't responsible for creating the universe. I am correct in thinking that your position hasn't changed and still is that there is no reason to invoke creationism to explain why the universe exists or to assume that the unknown phenomena is responsible for it? You're doing it again. When did I claim any of this? You appear to be VERY confused about who has said what. Also, what is are you referring to by "unkown phenomena" ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danot Posted January 22, 2012 Author Share Posted January 22, 2012 What a profound and insightful gem! What can I say? You got me bang to rights. I am "an hypocritical atheists." Just want you to know that I'm proud of you, takes a big man to admit when he's wrong, especially on a public forum. You've just gone up in my estimation. Hey, Is it just me or do you feel like having a man-hug too?. I might not be with you brother but I'm definitely feeling love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danot Posted January 22, 2012 Author Share Posted January 22, 2012 It has recently been discovered that a lot of phenomena are governed by principles new to our understanding, and these principles are still only partially understood. However, this does not mean that any illogical BS anyone cares to invent can now be justified as being governed by the laws of quantum physics."Ooh, i've got an invisible head in another dimension. Quantum physics, innit." Creationism neither conforms to conventional logic nor the laws of quantum physics. Because creationists - who rarely possess a good understanding of any scientific discipline - try to justify creationism with conventional logic, it is on that level which it is generally challenged. I'm sure if any were bold enough to use quantum theory in an attempt to back up their claims, there would be plenty of people with a genuine understanding of physics who would be only too willing to expose their charade. Does claiming that universe could have always existed without needing a cause conform to conventional logic or the laws of quantum physics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janie48 Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 So surely it follows that that someone who is giving up everything they have ever known is making a bigger sacrifice than someone who is exchanging their place on Earth for eternal paradise? Is that a general atheist view then? That the sacrifice of an atheist would be a BIGGER one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSmith Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Does claiming that universe could have always existed without needing a cause conform to conventional logic or the laws of quantum physics? Yes it conforms to everything we know and can prove, everything else is speculation, myth, or theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gormenghast Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I don't really agree with the term 'created'. It implies there is a creator with intent. I see the universe as having no intention or purpose behind it. So, IMO, it hasn't been created. We are here because of the laws of physics. We won't be here much longer (in geological time that is) and will not be remembered in another million years. We're just what happens to be a successful lifeform in the current conditions of the universe. No te veré más tarde. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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