danot Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 You're not making sense. I don't believe in the Christian god, and you call me a hypocrite for celebrating Easter despite the fact that I don't attach any religious significance to the holiday. You admit to celebrating Easter, and furthermore actually assert that it is in commemoration of the resurrection of Jesus Christ, and yet you don't believe in the Christian god too. That sir is hypocrisy. Yes, I do celebrate Easter even though I don't believe in the Christian God, and yes, I did make the assertion that Easter is in commemoration of the Resurrection of Jesus Christ, which it is, and has been since long before the protestant reformation and the various other off-shoots that tainted the religious significance of commemorative holidays such as Christmas and Easter according to some Christian groups. - "Along with Christian celebrations, many Easter traditions ultimately became casualties of the various off-shoots of the protestant reformation, being deemed "Pagan" or "Popish" (and therefore tainted) by many puritan movements- although there were some major reformation churches and movements (Lutheran, Methodist, and Anglican for example), that chose to retain a reasonably full observance of the church year and many of it's associated traditions. In Lutheran churches, for example, not only were the days of holy week observed, but also Christmas, Easter, and pentecost were observed with three day festivals, including the day itself and the two following. "Some Christian groups continue to reject the the celebration of Easter, due to perceived pagan roots and historical connections to the practices and permissions of the Roman catholic church. Other nonconformist christian groups that do still celebrate the event prefer to call it "Resurrection Sunday" or "Resurrection day" for the same reason as well as a rejection of secular and commercial aspects of the holiday in the 20th and 21st centuries." http://en.wiki.pedia/wiki/Easter There you see, Easter and Christmas were Christian holidays long before they were hijacked and tainted by protestant and secular movements, and just because these holidays are celebrated by hypocrites who don't attach any religious significance to them, it doesn't alter the reason why we celebrate the holidays. And yes, I am one of those hypocrites. Posted by quisquose Your believe in "something" somehow prevents you from being a hypocrite. How ridiculous. Do you celebrate every religious holiday, or just the Christian ones that you don't believe in? Is is just the Christian god that you have chosen to represent "something" for yourself? I don't mind admitting that I'm an hypocrite who jumps on the commercial band wagon at Easter and Christmas, I hold up my hands and shout aloud that I am an hypocrite who celebrates Easter and Christmas even though I don't believe in the Christian God, and you Sir, are no different. Posted by quisquose In addition how dare you assert that I believe in "nothing". You have no idea what my beliefs are beyond what I have typed here. A lack of belief in gods does not equate to believing in "nothing". You're the one who proclaimed be an agnostic atheist. Believing that you were agnostic I assumed you'd be skeptical about anything of a metaphysical nature.. judging by your response it would appear that I am clearly wrong. Go on then, tell me what you believe in then tell me why you believe in it when you claim to be agnostic as well as atheist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Just thought I'd actually respond to the OP ! What is it that defines 'being an atheist' anyhow? Is it simply having no belief in God, or is there more to it than that? Atheism = without belief in God. That's the only criteria you have to meet to be an atheist. You don't have to deny the existence of God, you don't even have to believe there probably isn't a God. All you need is an absence of belief in it. What belief system must one acquire to become a fully fledged atheist To become a fully fledged atheist, you don't need any belief system. as opposed to an agnostic who doesn't realize that atheism and agnosticism are not the same thing? An agnostic doesn't need a belief system either, even if they don't realise that atheism and agnosticism are not the same thing. would you need to passionately believe that there is no God; that there cannot be a God; that the very concept of a God is preposterous? No Would you need to believe that those who do believe in God and put their faith and trust in God are delusional? Would religious rituals such as worshiping God and praying to God and singing in praise to God be the subjects of scorn and ridicule to a true atheist? No Would the 'I'll practice the bits I like but ignore the bits that don't suit' attitude within religion be viewed as hypocritical, insincere, pretentious bull crap to a fully fledged atheist? They could be viewed like that by ANYONE, including theists. On the flip side though Would taking annual leave to celebrate Christmas be something a fully fledged atheist should decline on the grounds of general principle? Should they refrain from buying and accepting gifts at Christmas? Should they refrain from buying and accepting easter eggs at easter? Not really Should a fully fledged atheist object to religious holidays being enforced without any consideration towards how the significance of such holidays conflicts with and compromises the beliefs, values and general principles of atheism? Only if they want to, in which case they would be acting ANTItheistic. Hang on, rewind..... ...conflicts with and compromises the beliefs, values and general principles of atheism? WHAT beliefs, values and principles are those? Should fully fledged atheists demand on having their own annual holidays that have no religious significance attached to them in order to avoid being viewed as hypocritical, insincere, agnostics full of pretentious bull crap? Not really, and why do you think agnostics are insincere, hypocritical and full of pretentious bull crap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danot Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 So danot believes in the existence of something which happens to be the "same something" that ignorant, fearful, credulous, superstitious folk invented in foreign lands 2300-1700 yrs ago by mixing older Judaic twaddle with Hellenistic Greco-Roman twaddle. He believes in the Christian god: a god that Christians have no uniform concept of; one that's just as subjective as its many religions. So, danot, which Christian god do you believe in? God is merely the English name for the something that is worshiped by various religious. If this something that I believe in is the same something that Christians believe in, it would be God. If it's the same something that Muslims believe in, it would be Allah. However, if it's the same something that Sikhs believe in it would be more difficult to define using just one word. If it's the same something that agnostics refer to, the question is unanswerable . If it's the same something that atheists have no belief in- asking the question becomes a pointless exercise because most atheists wouldn't entertain the notion of a God-like creator which has always existed without cause, most atheists are more incline to simply believe that it is 'everything in creation' which has always existed without cause, which coincidentally, is what pantheists believe also. A pantheist agnostic atheist... Hmmmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercurian Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes you a car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 God is merely the English name for the something that is worshiped by various religious. If this something that I believe in is the same something that Christians believe in, it would be God. If it's the same something that Muslims believe in, it would be Allah. However, if it's the same something that Sikhs believe in it would be more difficult to define using just one word. So how does your "same God" fit in with polytheistic religions? If it's the same something that agnostics refer to, the question is unanswerable . What is this something that they refer to? And what is there reference to it? If it's the same something that atheists have no belief in- asking the question becomes a pointless exercise because most atheists wouldn't entertain the notion of a God-like creator which has always existed without cause, most atheists are more incline to simply believe that it is 'everything in creation' which has always existed without cause, which coincidentally, is what pantheists believe also. A pantheist agnostic atheist... Hmmmmm There's no description of agnosticism in this bit above. Also.. "Pantheist - 1 a doctrine that identifies God with the universe, or regards the universe as a manifestation of God" so that rules out an atheist pantheist. Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes you a car. Nice to see some people are on topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danot Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 Yep that’s right when I was Christened, I had no belief in God so I was still an atheist and not a theist, when I was confirmed I was still an atheist and only a Christian because that’s what my parents wanted me to be, After many years of being forced to be a Christian I still remained an atheist, despite all the Christian teaching I received I still had no belief in God so remained an atheist. I have an interest in religion and despite all the religious study I am still an atheist. At the time I didn’t know I was an atheist because I hadn’t come across the word as a young child.Are you an atheist who has no belief, or an atheist Christian waiting for a reason to believe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSmith Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 So how does your "same God" fit in with polytheistic religions? What is this something that they refer to? And what is there reference to it? There's no description of agnosticism in this bit above. Also.. "Pantheist - 1 a doctrine that identifies God with the universe, or regards the universe as a manifestation of God" so that rules out an atheist pantheist. Nice to see some people are on topic I would say that danot is a pantheist that appears to be very insecure in there beliefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gormenghast Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 When will people finally realise that we are all here as a result of the conditions of the universe, and we're all going to die, there is no god, and we'll all be subsumed into nothingness. Get used to it. We're here because of a cosmic accident. And in a few million years we won't be. Enjoy it while you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSmith Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Are you an atheist who has no belief, or an atheist Christian waiting for a reason to believe? I was christened so according to the dictionary I am a Christian but I have no belief in God so I am an atheist, I am also an anti-theist and an apathiest, because if someone proved the existence of God I wouldn't care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Are you an atheist who has no belief Heheh are you a vegan who eats no meat? Or a Christian who believes in Christ? Or maybe a typist who incidentally, types! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.