six45ive Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Great discussion six45ive - loads of areas for agreement but no shifting of any lines in the sand! I'll consider de Botton's proposal dead and buried for SFers, but thanks for all contributions to the discussion. No problem. Good to meet you. Doesn't time fly when you're having fun? I hope you gained as much out of the conversation as I did. I think de Botton's ideas are not only not just his ideas but they're pretty irrelevant to more than just SFers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suffragette1 Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Why doesn't everyone or indeed, anyone, who goes to Lourdes, get better? Just asking, like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quisquose Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I can't say that I've experienced anyone trying to impose their religious beliefs on me ... although I'm not saying it doesn't happen. Really? Eaten Halal food recently? Have you even known if you have? Only two weekends ago I was walking down Fargate and I noticed the usual chap with his sign, wandered past two guys who had set up an Islam stall and had a girl push a leaflet in my hand about the scientific predictions in the Koran, and then there was the makeshift stage that had been set up with a full-blown rap band belting out their love of Jeeeesus at top volume, complete with half a dozen people handing out leaflets inviting me to their evangelical church. To cap it all, I got on the tram to Meadowhell and had to endure some woman singing Gospel songs. A few days later I went to a parents evening, and one of the parents insisted that every teacher he sat with should accept, and read, the "Truth About Islam" booklet that he gave them. These are just examples I've noticed from the last fortnight of the day to day attempts to impose religious beliefs. Of course I can roll my eyes and ignore these things, and I would fight for their rights to advertise their beliefs. Unfortunately some would like to prevent my natural instincts to ridicule them, and force me to respect them, and religious adherents do actively endeavour to force their beliefs on me through political lobbying, of which there are plenty of examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
altus Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 A few days later I went to a parents evening, and one of the parents insisted that every teacher he sat with should accept, and read, the "Truth About Islam" booklet that he gave them. I hope you're going to take a copy of The God Delusion to the next one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwhine Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Why doesn't everyone or indeed, anyone, who goes to Lourdes, get better? Just asking, like. 'Cos they float around in the water where people with all kinds of diseases have gone before. They go in sick an come out terminal. (Like people going into hospital with a sprained ankle and catching MRSA.) An estimated 200 million people have visited the shrine since 1860, and the Roman Catholic Church has officially recognised 68 healings considered miraculous. ...from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lourdes 68 healings out of 200,000,000 patients? If that were a hospital, it'd be shut down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suffragette1 Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 'Cos they float around in the water where people with all kinds of diseases have gone before. They go in sick an come out terminal. (Like people going into hospital with a sprained ankle and catching MRSA.) ...from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lourdes 68 healings out of 200,000,000 patients? If that were a hospital, it'd be shut down. :hihi: Quite. The chances of winning the lottery are probably greater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairDooz Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share Posted February 16, 2012 ....or you could give your opinion of my posting about the ten commandments I think I'll pass on that if you don't mind RB. Alain de Botton's proposal for Atheism 2.0 was the subject of this thread and I can't see any prospect of finding common ground on this topic. I'm sure you'll find someone to discuss related issues ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I think I'll pass on that if you don't mind RB. Alain de Botton's proposal for Atheism 2.0 was the subject of this thread and I can't see any prospect of finding common ground on this topic. I'm sure you'll find someone to discuss related issues ... That's odd, it seemed to be a related issue when you brought it up as an example of a moral checklist in religion (which we could learn from)... If I wished to copy your example, where would I begin? What's your version of the ten commandments for example? (That's an example, let's not get bogged down in what the actual ten commandments are, I'm just wondering whether you have any kind of checklist to refer to). I told you the origin of my morals and then asked you about the ten commandments as a moral checklist. But you seem to want it to only work one way I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borderline Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I find engaging on this subject not very fullfilling . There is bad religion from the top down and history of bad science even worse . If you want a thoughtful read try The Great Partnership by jonathan Sacks to see that science can live with faith and what happens when things go wrong . The lessons from history are stark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairDooz Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share Posted February 16, 2012 RB - let me help you a little ... You quoted me ... That's an example, let's not get bogged down in what the actual ten commandments are, I'm just wondering whether you have any kind of checklist to refer to. Let's focus a little That's an example, let's not get bogged down in what the actual ten commandments are ... This bit was important ... That's an example, let's not get bogged down and focus some more ... let's not get bogged down All of the above led to a question to you about your moral checklist. If I remember, You mentioned Aesop's Fables. That's cool, whatever works for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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