Fuel prices MEGATHREAD

[metalman]

If you own a car and are happy to pay the standing costs of ownership then the cost of fuel to actually use it to get out and about is still quite a marginal expense.

 

If you cost the trip to Scarborough using public transport using the car is a no-brainer and the convenience/flexibility/comfort argument blows public transport out of the water.

 

Our location forces us to use a car to get anywhere useful so increasing fuel costs will have to be met by savings in other expenses.

 

I didn't say it would be cheaper to get there by public transport - it obviously wouldn't. I just said it would be cheaper not to go at all. Which it obviously would. And if we all decide not to bother, then presumably those places in Scarborough where people spent a few quid will be the worse off.

[Cyclone]

Quite - the price will rise, making another limited resource economically viable, until that too becomes scarce.

 

I understand that the majority of what I pay for petrol is tax, and that I'm buying it with income I've already been taxed on, and that when I buy fuel I pay tax (VAT) on tax (fuel duty).

 

None of that changes the fact that supply is limited in the long term, short of technological innovation, and that demand is increasing.

This isn't what you've been claiming until now though.

You've been saying that prices are rising due to supply being limited.

That isn't the case. In the long run prices will rise due to that affect, but at the moment the supply is only artificially limited.

 

Thus, ultimately fuel is going to get more costly.

Yes, but that doesn't explain todays prices, which is where you started the thread.

One day there will be a litre of petrol left, and billions of people wanting to buy it. It'll cost a darn sight more than £1.15. Each day we get slightly closer to that situation prices will creep up - and I don't doubt the fuel companies, aware they are selling something they will run out of are making the most of it and maximising their profits. That doesn't change the supply and demand situation either.

We have not run out of oil, the supply is no different today than it was 5 years ago.

 

The question that interests me is whether the current price of fuel, or it's assumed direction (up) is affecting people in interesting and new ways yet.

That may well interest you, but you keep explaining why the price is currently high and telling people to ignore the fact that 80% of what we pay is tax. I disagree with part of your analysis about why the price is high and thus with your exclusion of other relevant factors. The government increased fuel duty a few days ago, that has a direct impact on the pump price.

If their is a solution to this problem I feel it has to be an alternative fuel that can be used in existing cars - there are too many engines out there for them all to be simply replaced. I don't understand why the government isn't pumping money in to the bacteria that excrete petrol or diesel and are fed on kitchen waste. Surely that's a win/win - less waste, carbon neutral fuel and you can use your existing car? And if we get the tech right we can licence it to replace the income lost when the North Sea wells run dry.

The government is assuming that the free market will take care of it, and it's probably true.

[upinwath]

The government is assuming that the free market will take care of it, and it's probably true.

 

What you should have said was...

 

The government is assuming that you are stupid and will rant but do nothing about it, it's probably true

 

Most of the fuel price is tax but the raw cost is being increased because Labour have totally shagged the pound against pretty much everything including the 'toy town' euro that is falling apart because of the cheats used to get countries into it.

The pound is worth less against the dollar and oil is traded in dallars so you get less for your quid. Toss in the massive tax and you have seriously expensive fuel.

Still 30p/L out here. You silly sods are being ripped off and <removed> by Gordon Brown every time you fill up.

 

Don't vote labour unless you like a sore arse from being shafted by Mr Brown.

[John1954]

What you should have said was...

 

 

 

Most of the fuel price is tax but the raw cost is being increased because Labour have totally shagged the pound against pretty much everything including the 'toy town' euro that is falling apart because of the cheats used to get countries into it.

The pound is worth less against the dollar and oil is traded in dallars so you get less for your quid. Toss in the massive tax and you have seriously expensive fuel.

Still 30p/L out here. You silly sods are being ripped off and <removed> by Gordon Brown every time you fill up.

 

Don't vote labour unless you like a sore arse from being shafted by Mr Brown.

 

How is Gordon Brown managing to arse shag the inhabitants of France, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, Germany, Greece, Netherlands, Italy, Norway, Portugal and Sweden?

 

These countries currently have higher petrol prices than we do.

 

Or was this another of your misinformed party political broadcasts?

[truman]

How is Gordon Brown managing to arse shag the inhabitants of France, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, Germany, Greece, Netherlands, Italy, Norway, Portugal and Sweden?

 

These countries currently have higher petrol prices than we do.

 

Or was this another of your misinformed party political broadcasts?

 

Do we know what the pre tax cost of fuel in these countries is? Or to put it another way who has the highest tax on fuel..? Genuine question by the way..

[Cyclone]

What you should have said was...

 

 

 

Most of the fuel price is tax but the raw cost is being increased because Labour have totally shagged the pound against pretty much everything including the 'toy town' euro that is falling apart because of the cheats used to get countries into it.

All 3 currencies (£, $, E) are in a race to the bottom, it will keep going up and down as to which is loosing ground the fastest, but basically the currencies need to devalue to be competitive on the world stage.

The pound is worth less against the dollar and oil is traded in dallars so you get less for your quid. Toss in the massive tax and you have seriously expensive fuel.

Still 30p/L out here. You silly sods are being ripped off and <removed> by Gordon Brown every time you fill up.

 

Don't vote labour unless you like a sore arse from being shafted by Mr Brown.

Indeed, his economic mismanagement is part of the reason we are where we are.

But no party is about to drastically cut fuel duty.

[truman]

Do we know what the pre tax cost of fuel in these countries is? Or to put it another way who has the highest tax on fuel..? Genuine question by the way..

 

To answer my own question I've has a look round..it looks like that a couple of years ago we were the highest taxed in Europe and on reading this I see no reason for that to have changed..so yes, the reason we have high fuel prices is down to Brown and his taxes...

[epiphany]

Fuel Prices - what are you going to do?

 

I'm going to vote for a party that actually has renewable energy and modernised infrastructure high on their agenda. I'm going to bank with companies whose investment decisions are more healthily balanced between sustainability and profit.

 

Any other ideas?

[upinwath]

How is Gordon Brown managing to arse shag the inhabitants of France, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, Germany, Greece, Netherlands, Italy, Norway, Portugal and Sweden?

 

These countries currently have higher petrol prices than we do.

 

Or was this another of your misinformed party political broadcasts?

 

Flies are right to eat dog crap because dung beetles do it as well.

That's what you are saying in that post.

 

So other countries are being screwed as well. Does that make your rear end shafting any better for you?

 

Oil is traded in US$. The Euro (Toy town) money may be worth less against the dollar but so is the good old quid.

The pound is at about 75% of it's mid 2008 value against the dollar at today's rate.

That means you are paying more for the same thing than before so the pump price rises. A 1p rise is really a 4p rise because of tax.

 

It also means your cheap Chinese made electronics are going to see a price rise. Everything is traded in Dollars to you have to pay more for the same thing.

Thanks for sod all Gordon Brown and Tony Blair.

[John1954]

Flies are right to eat dog crap because dung beetles do it as well.

That's what you are saying in that post.

 

So other countries are being screwed as well. Does that make your rear end shafting any better for you?

 

No, what I'm saying is that duty on fuel is a common and popular way to raise revenue in western Europe. If duty on fuel was drastically reduced, what would you tax to raise the lost revenue, or what services would you cut?

 

Oil is traded in US$. The Euro (Toy town) money may be worth less against the dollar but so is the good old quid.

The pound is at about 75% of it's mid 2008 value against the dollar at today's rate.

That means you are paying more for the same thing than before so the pump price rises. A 1p rise is really a 4p rise because of tax.

 

It also means your cheap Chinese made electronics are going to see a price rise. Everything is traded in Dollars to you have to pay more for the same thing.

 

The exchange rate is favourable or unfavourable depending on your point of view. You are viewing it solely from the importer's perspective. Using your example we can now expect 33% more Sterling for exporting the same goods in US Dollars than we did in mid 2008.

 

Incidentally, not everything is traded in US Dollars. I think you'll find most trade in Europe is conducted in Euros.

 

Thanks for sod all Gordon Brown and Tony Blair.

 

I certainly appreciate the huge increase in living standards for me and most people in this country under their stewardship.